Question On Specials?

[Phox532]

Sorry for all the threads in this topic. I am not trying to take it over. Just a newbie looking for answers.

My question is on specials and Named toons. First what are the rules for these in AoS. He was saying that no named toons could be in standard play and that there were not allowed in league play, is that true? almost ever AoS battle rep that I have watched on youtube or Youku have had named toons in them. Second he was saying that the Hellebron was a named toon and that I was trying to exploit the game by using her in my army.

Now I'm new to the game, but I don't see what he is saying. I will agree that she is more powerful than a normal Sorceresses it terms of magic, but she has a 33% chance of killing her self and not preforming some of her magics. Second he has stated that the Death Hag is not is not a Special or Named toon. I don't see the deference, They are both unique in their own way, and not real a Sorceress. I don't think that either are game breaking and with sudden death options, I unsure what he means by exploiting as he can set the sudden death conditions.

Last there is something that has put me off about all this. I know that he is playing Dwarfs or Empire or a combo of the two. And he has Cannons and guns and all that jazz. He knows that no of the rest of us have War Machines, but he is saying that its okay cause "balance". I know that he wants to keep games causal and doesn't want it to be too competitive. And that me using a Hellebron is not in the "spirit of the game". But again him using two cannons is in the spirit of the game as he has told me many times that he is going to rain down on my troops.

I'm just really put off about this whole exchange. Mostly cause he told me to buy models I though were cool and wanted to have, and that we could play with anything. And now I feel that I am buying some models that I'll never get to play with while I'm here in China. And there are only like three or four people in the city that play, so I feel like I really can't challenge him on this cause then I won't be asked to play in this "league".

[Crowsfoot]

It can only be his "league" rules that say you can't use named models.

House rules= what the players decide is fair not a player.

If there is something you feel unbalances the game in his/your favour voice your concerns.

AOS rules has no restrictions on using named models so it must be a rule he has settled on.

If he is raining down fire on you get some Darkshards and a couple of reaper bolt throwers to rain your own fire, see if he objects to you using them.

How are you balancing the game, wound count or limit the warscrolls?

[Red...]

As far as I know, any character can be used in AoS that has an entry in the army pdf, which includes a good few named characters.

It must be, as Crowsfoot says, his own league restrictions. That's fairly normal - a good few tournies and leagues in previous editions banned the named characters. Sadly, if that's the rules of the league, that's the rules of the league. The models should be usable as generic versions of the named character (e.g. hellebron should be usable as a death hag).

I've come across the phenomena you talk about: players adapting the rules to depict their own unbalanced choices as being "fair" while those of others as "unfair". There's not much you can do, sadly, if he runs the league. Best way forward is to figure out ways to maximize your strengths that are allowed in the house rules for the league and beat him senseless (metaphorically) with your "fair" army.

[Phox532]

What he had said before is that we are balancing by number of wounds, 75-100 wounds. That was all that he has said.

Now I have posted my army that I had planned, doesn't have Hellebron. and I thought about putting her in as the General and dropping my Dreadlord on Coldone. So I would stay at 86 wounds. I lose one synergy but gain another.

As for RBT, I'd love to have them, but I can't fin a store on taoboa.com that has them.

[direweasel]

If I'm doing a Sigmar army with 100 wounds and no named characters, it would be 10 Beastmasters on Manticores.

Of course, I'd need to get 6 more before that's really an option, but it sure sounds like fun to try!

[Icon hack]

If I'm doing a Sigmar army with 100 wounds and no named characters, it would be 10 Beastmasters on Manticores.

While this might be playable, I don't think it would be as awesome as you might think.

What we found is that in spite of our original expectations to the contrary, characters aren't all that great in AoS. What we've seen is that during the combat phase you tend to want to use full sized units before Characters since they generally have more attacks and the potential to do greater damage. For example, if you had a choice between a Beastmaster on Manticore and a unit of 10 Executioners, or a unit of 10 Witch Elves (all the same wound count) you would typically want to choose the Executioner or WE first. Especially if you have other synergies in play, like a Death Hag standing behind the WE's feeding them some brew.

A few characters are nice (and necessary), because they create useful synergies but a well balanced list works much better.

[Phox532]

@Icon, I agree with you. I have been reading all the war scrolls for the armies that I am likely to encounter and I have not read anything that would seem broken or Op. And because you can basically target characters, they are pretty squishy. I have seen several battle reps where a guy lost two of his named toons before they were able to really be effective in the fight.