Black Horrors Template oddity (7th)

[Cat-the-odd]

Hejo,

I found to read in my DE book (It's german, but I think this applies to the english one, too) that the black horror affects every model touching the template. No standard sentance like "hit on 4+ if not covered completely".
I have two interpretations:

a) Apply the core book which states that teplate attacks (like spells) do hit partly covered models on 4+

b) Read it as written and hit all touched bases

Without clarification I'd play it like the rulebook....

cat-the-confused

[Krystalice2020]

Go by how it says in the army book. It does in fact hit EVERYTHING it touches...

[Mordru]

My english version omits the 4+ language. Everything touched by the template will be effected. Black Horror now with new and improved extra strength horror action (brought to you by the power of darkness).

[Dalamar]

No clarification needed, army books override rulebook when specific rules are re-written
Black Horror indeed only needs to touch a model to affect it fully.

[Silverheimdall]

ALSO! 40k templates now, by the core rulebook - all hit even on partials, no more 4+.

White I know this isn't 40k, it just shows that their ruling about templates may be slowly changing for fantasy as well and the first case is of course Black Horror.

[Grogsnotpowwabomba]

The removal partials is a great move I think. That was an extra, unnecessary step.

Most things in 40K and Fantasy that use templates would be deadly to anything even partially covered, and I'm glad they finally realized this and made the change.

Wow, GW is actually making their games better. Unbelievable...

[Kinslayer]

Wow, GW is actually making their games better. Unbelievable...

so it would seem, and the dark elves is as fine a place as any to start

[Kyrel]

As a DE player I won't complain about this change, but if they start making this a general rule, then I'll start complaining. The partial rule is quite alright as it is.

[Ehakir]

Kinda weird that the BD-egg's breath weapon, the BD breath weapon and the Hydra breath weapon need 4+'s though...

[Thanee]

Why is that weird?

It's a specific bonus for Black Horror, not a general rule.

Bye
Thanee

[Silverheimdall]

Kinda weird that the BD-egg's breath weapon, the BD breath weapon and the Hydra breath weapon need 4+'s though...

You can duck, dodge, stop/drop/roll out of the breath weapon's path, but you can't do much about a Portal that sucks you into an infernal region. (Black Horror's fluff)

[Voodoomaster]

Why is that weird?

It's a specific bonus for Black Horror, not a general rule.

Bye
Thanee

indeed, the intention when we were writing the book was "ok so a portal to the realms of chaos is essentially opened up above their heads and sucking at their souls...how can you dodge that?

[Silverheimdall]

Had it been an Initiative Test (to dodge it of course) like Pit of Shades, partials could've made sense, but this one is a strength test to see if you get sucked into the portal, so people closeby would of course need to resist with their own strength to stay put.

It works from the point of logic, fluff and the "armybook overules rulebook" I hear so often for other things.

[Mordru]

It doesn't mean anything in WFB but in the new 5th edition of 40k they have totally eliminated partial hits in applying template weapons or so my 40k playing friends tell me. Perhaps they will phase it out for WFB as well?

[Silverheimdall]

Already mentionned that a few posts above ;p

Also, I'm debating on Da Warpath wether Magic Resist kicks in at all for Black Horror - because only when succesfully cast do you place the Center of the Large Template Anywhere within 18" of your Caster, there is no mention anywhere in the spell of targetting an Enemy Unit!

[Kinslayer]

40k and fantasy are 2 different things.

Black Horror and other template attacks are different things.


I like the way black horror and the template works now, its a lot more dangerous (before if it covered 8 and partialled 8, you averaged hitting 12. Now it hits 16 end of). Magic and especially dark magic is supposed to be very very dangerous.

Hence why they nerfed the miscast table for 7th edition, and hence why they nerf the big spells for 7th edition.

[Mordru]

Magic and especially dark magic is supposed to be very very dangerous.

Hence why they nerfed the miscast table for 7th edition, and hence why they nerf the big spells for 7th edition.

Nerfed miscast table? Compared to what? There has only been a miscast table since 6th edition and the 7th edition version is much more penal.

[Kinslayer]

thats what i meant, they are making magic more dangerous in this edition to both user and enemy.

[Mordru]

I can't be sure what you meant so I am certainly not going to try to tell you what you meant. I can however show yu what you said. Unfortunately, I am not sure you selected the terms you needed to convey your point.

When you say nerf it refers to the foam toys of the same name. The term nerf used in a WFB context is taken to mean that the effect that has been nerfed was softened and rendered ineffective. The miscast table has been made thouroughly nasty ... it has not been nerfed.

[Thanee]

Also, I'm debating on Da Warpath wether Magic Resist kicks in at all for Black Horror - because only when succesfully cast do you place the Center of the Large Template Anywhere within 18" of your Caster, there is no mention anywhere in the spell of targetting an Enemy Unit!

I had that same thought already (different situation, though... can you avoid the Ring of Hotek if you roll a double on the casting simply by placing the template elsewhere), but I think you have to decide on the center point and as such which units will be affected before the spell is dispelled, because units under the templates should be able to use their MR, and that's how it works against templates normally.

I usually declare the general direction (i.e. which unit I want to attack with the spell) before casting. That seems fair enough.

Bye
Thanee

[Archon_matt]

the miscast table wasn't NERFED for 7th Ed...it was made more nasty. T'was neither nerfed nor brokeded, just made a teensy bit more killy.

[Viper]

Actually, I prefer this miscast table. A little more deadly? Certainly, however much fewer results that completely shut down your magic phase. Having your magic phase shutdown well before your ready can throw a huge monkey wrench in your plans.

[Stretch_135]

GW has been moving away from the 'partials' since at least the 7th Ed. Empire book. The Helstorm rocket battery doesn't have a 4+ for partials either, anything that's even remotely touched by the template is affected. I imagine they did it to stop arguments along the lines of 'well, that one's partial because I can see one millimetre of the base just off to the left there...'

[Undeadcatd]

Can "Look out sir" avoid black horror?

[Silverheimdall]

It is a template attack, so yes.