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Beastmaster's Scourge: No more two hands? 

Does the Beastmaster Scourge combine with a hand weapon to use up two hand slots?
Yes 8%  8%  [ 2 ]
No 92%  92%  [ 24 ]
Total votes : 26

Beastmaster's Scourge: No more two hands? 
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Malekith's Best Friend
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In the past I have always been under the impression that the beastmaster scourge would be treated like an additional hand weapon in the previous edition. Now, is it just me, or does the errata give a profile which results in a one-handed weapon which replaces the hand weapon and grants armour piercing and an additional attack? The profile in the errata seems to miss the 'requires two hands' specification, just like the additional hand weapon profile in the BRB used to do before the errata. So how should we treat the scourge? Does it combine with a hand weapon and use up both hands, or does one hand satisfy for the scourge, enabling the user to carry a shield?

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Sun Aug 22, 2010 8:41 am
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Noble
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As far as I can remember, it is not considered a hand weapon anymore, but it does not have the Requires Two Hands rule, and therefore can be used with shield. Considering Whip of Agony just got this much better, I'm not really missing the chance to use it with a shield. :)

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Sun Aug 22, 2010 9:15 am
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The Guiding Eye
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No I don't think so - purely because they don't need improving: for example, the Hydra is overpowered enough as it is - GW know this and I highly doubt that they want to be responsible for improving it any further (by giving the beaster master apprentices effectively 4 attacks each...).

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Sun Aug 22, 2010 2:21 pm
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Dragon Lord
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Beastmaster's Scourge is now a single handed weapon (not a hand weapon) that gives armor piercing and extra attack special rules.

You can't use it with another hand weapon for one more attack so beastmasters stay with 3 attacks each.

But heroes can now combine it with a shield for extra armor.
Whip of Agony got quite a bit better (+1 A, AP, S5 and can be combined with a shield)

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Sun Aug 22, 2010 4:55 pm
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Warrior

Joined: Sun Oct 17, 2010 6:36 pm
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What about Beastmaster's Scourge + Dagger Of Hotek?
Will it grands:
BS (Armour Piercing, Extra Attack)
DoH (ASF)
..and additional attack as DoH is additional-hand-weapon?

So, we have +2 attack..
..or it must be thread like BS gives Extra Attack and additional-hand-weapon gives Extra Attack, and this two does not stack? ..so finally this combination grands +1 attack bonus?


Sun Oct 17, 2010 6:46 pm
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Assassin

Joined: Tue Jul 27, 2010 5:29 pm
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Post 
dagger of hotek specifficaly states it can be combined with a MUNDANE hand weapon, which means the basic weapon every hero has. although beastmaster scourge is a hand weapon its not a mundane hand weapon, same for all other hand weapons we can chose from.
Its called a hand weapon to differentiate to other things (rats have tail weapons) as ranged weapons for instance


Sun Oct 17, 2010 8:27 pm
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Dragon Lord
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Beastmaster's Scourge used to be a hand weapon. It's not anymore.

So you can't combine it with Dagger of Hotek.

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Sun Oct 17, 2010 9:23 pm
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Warrior

Joined: Sun Oct 17, 2010 6:36 pm
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Post 
Thank you for answer : )

page 88 BRB:
"Up until now, we've assumed that all models have been armed with a hand weapon."
-- so mundane hand weapon will be hand weapon as I suspect

I was searching for answer and the informations Ive found (before reading posts above) are:

page 89 BRB:
"If a model carries a special close combat weapon, he must fight with it in the Close Combat phase - he cannot elect to wield his hand weapon instead."

page 91 BRB:
"An additional hand weapon cannot be used by a mounted model, or by a model that has a magical close combat weapon.
Special Rules: Extra Attack"
-- so possibly I can use it with special 1hand weapon

page 2 Dark Elves Errata:
"The Beastmaster's Scourge is a special close combat weapon (...)
Special Rules: Extra Attack, Armour piercing"
-- Beastmaster's Scourge is a special CC 1hand weapon


page 2 BRB errata:
"Unlike most special rules, the effects of multiple Extra Attack special rules are cumulative."
-- so this two Extra Attack bonus stacks

page 101 DE armybook:
Dagger of Hotek
"(...) is an additional hand weapon, (it can be used with mundane hand weapon) (...)"
-- so maybe I can use it with Beastmaster's Scourge

page 2 BRB errata:
Two/Additional hand Weapons.
Add "Requires Two Hands." to the special rules on the profile.
-- or I can't?

1) So according to this mess I cannot use Beastmaster's Scourge with Dagger of Hotek becouse second one requires-two-hands to use. : )
2) I can not use this two becouse BS is not mundane weapon


btw, Gw ->DE ->articles ->Dreadlords and Masters Tactics ->page 2
Dagger Of Hotek (Character Killer 2) can not be used while mounted (as page 91 BRB says), so I think there is mistake : )


Sun Oct 17, 2010 9:46 pm
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Dragon Lord
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Post 
2 is correct answer.
Beastmaster's Scourge is no longer a hand weapon, it's a special weapon.
This means:

It can't be combined with another weapon mundane or magical to gain Extra Attack rule (so beastmasters stay with 3 attacks each because they can't use their hand weapons with the Scourge)

It can be combined with a shield for extra protection but will not give Parry save.

It doesn't require two hands to use. It just can't be combined with another weapon.

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Sun Oct 17, 2010 10:35 pm
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Warrior

Joined: Sun Oct 17, 2010 6:36 pm
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Post 
Hello Dalamar, sorry for my bad english. I was trying to said that Dagger of Hotek is an additional hand weapon (DE armybook) and as it is written in BRB errata, AHW has a special rule Requires Two Hand to use, so answer 1) is correct too : -)

//or I am missing something


Mon Oct 18, 2010 5:51 am
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