New Army - 2k points

[Iskiab]

Hey,

I'm just getting back into Warhammer and I'm building a Druchii army. My thinking is I'm going to first paint 2k points so I can play as soon as possible. I'm a bit of a perfectionist, so I'm hoping that if I only paint the necessary points to fill a 2k list I'll be done before the next dark elf book is out o.O

From my list it's probably pretty obvious I like witch elves, but I also want to field a competitive list, even something that could do well in tournaments.

Here's my list:

350 points - Crone Hellebron

225 points - Death Hag with CoB
Battle Standard

150 points - Sorceress - lvl 1
- 2 dispell scrolls

150 points - Sorceress - lvl 1
- 2 dispell scrolls

Core:

155 points - 20 Dark Elf Warriors w/shields
- Full Command

100 points - 10 Repeater Crossbows

100 points - 10 Repeater Crossbows

90 points - 5 Dark Riders w/shields

55 points - 5 Harpies

55 points - 5 Harpies

50 points - 5 Witch Elves

50 points - 5 Witch Elves

Special:

135 points - 5 Cold One Knights

60 points - 5 Executioners

Rare:

100 points - Repeater Bolt Thrower

175 points - Hydra

============================

2k points.

Now here's the thing, when I last played Warhammer there were no dispell dice or anything like that, magic worked differently. Plus you had stats like Intelligence and cool, so it's been a while. I've done some research and people mentioned a dispell scroll caddie which is what I've aimed for. Is my anti-magic setup above good enough, overkill, inefficient?

I'd also like some opinions on the list in general. Where should I change it?

[Pokatchu]

ok there is my 2 cent

i dont like hellebron; she hit hard but have NO defence!! if you absolutly want to play her, put her in a unit whit the ASF banner. Second, MSU can be ok but you need at least a few bigger unit to protect your characters. Your unit are so strong that any lost will make the unit useless!any of them that get charged in dead on the spot!i think you have a bitt too much magic protection! 4 Dispel dice and 4 DS is overkill IMO. wish it help!!

[Iskiab]

Hum, yea I'm worried about just the things you mentioned.

The reason I went so overboard on magic defense is I want an all comer army. I want to be able to dispell almost all the magic thrown at me, and I only begin with 4 dispell dice, and some 2k armies boast 10 attack dice.

Yes, she doesn't have much defense. The only thing she has going for her is the parrying blade (-1 enemy attack) and cry of war (enemy leadership test or -1 WS). That and the magic defense amulet that gives a 4+ ward save for her unit vs all magic.

The thing is, she has no armor save but she also negates all enemy armor. The Deathsword is a strength 10 hit - which means that when she hits my opponent will have a +7 to your armor save. So a 1+ armor save person gets no armor save against her. Having a strength that's that high also has little advantages too like if she hits a chariot it'll be automatically destroyed.

Then she also gets 4 attacks, +1 for extra weapon, + d3 for 6-8 attacks per round. Considering she gets to reroll misses because of hatred she's a killing machine. The trick is she has to attack first... I honestly can't even see a dragon standing up to her for more then a round of combat, if she gets to attack first that is, she could be dead before she gets to attack in a challenge. Her problem, like you mentioned is weak defense.

I like her, it's just her points cost that's hard to swollow. 350 is a lot.

My main concern is what you mentioned, the groupts of 5 WE and Executioners, If they take one hit, they're unit strength goes to below 5 so they won't even be effective for flanking (you need at least a unit strength of 5 to negate ranks and get the flank bonus).

So how would you change the list then? What's a better alternative for spell caddying or witch elf/Executioners?

What I was thinking of doing is having Crone join a WE unit for a charge (gets to attack first) and then leaving and joining another one if I lose guys? I don't know if that's practical....

Here's what I was thinking for deployment. Warriors in the middle flanked by a line of 10 repeater crossbows on each side. Witch Elves, CoB and BG behind the repeaters and warriors for missle cover.
Then have my Dark riders on one flank to march block, etc... fly my harpies up on both sides to march block. Then roll my Cold ones and hydra up on the other flank, opposite to my Dark Riders.

So try to delay on one flank and own the other one.

[Pointystick]

Well if you like witch elves alot, they are a core unit choice when you take hellborn. Why not drop the spear warriors to beef up your khanite units a bit?

[Iskiab]

I'm worried about misslefire. If I'm against an army that's misslefire weak and I want to go defensive, I want the option to fight an attrition battle.

That's why instead of stretching my army in a long line along the board what I'll be doing is hiding my khainite (expensive) units behind my repeaters or warriors. Really, the only pratical purpose of the warriors is to soak up misslefire and shield my CoB and expensive stuff.

Do you think that's a good idea?

What's a good size for witch elves then? I chose 5 because that's the minimum, plus Helbron has an ability that negates all your opponents rank bonuses. All I have to do is join a unit of 5 WE and on a charge I'd be able to rout almost any unit unless it's unshakable or stubborn.

[Iskiab]

ok there is my 2 cent

i dont like hellebron; she hit hard but have NO defence!! if you absolutly want to play her, put her in a unit whit the ASF banner.

I looked into this, I was thinking an ASF banner would really help me in combat with her, especially against an army like high elves where her great initiative wouldn't help.

The ASF banner is a 35 point banner, Banner of Hag Grief, and ONLY a unit of Black Guard can use it. All the other units are capped at using 25 point banners.

I don't know if having Hellebon with a Black Guard unit is a good idea. They aren't Khainite, and Hellebron is only stubborn if within 12" of the CoB. Plus she's not immune to psych. Black Guard are also Malekith's guards, Hellebron would use WEs.

[Shadow dark]

Hey,

I'm just getting back into Warhammer and I'm building a Druchii army. My thinking is I'm going to first paint 2k points so I can play as soon as possible. I'm a bit of a perfectionist, so I'm hoping that if I only paint the necessary points to fill a 2k list I'll be done before the next dark elf book is out o.O

From my list it's probably pretty obvious I like witch elves, but I also want to field a competitive list, even something that could do well in tournaments.

Here's my list:

350 points - Crone Hellebron
Fine

225 points - Death Hag with CoB
Battle Standard
Try adding either the Rune of Khaine or the standard of Hag Graef, to add killing power.

150 points - Sorceress - lvl 1
- 2 dispell scrolls

150 points - Sorceress - lvl 1
- 2 dispell scrolls
I would consider dropping one sorceress. 4 dispel dice are not much better than 3 in my experience, and opponents tend to get upset when facing more than 2 scrolls.

Core:

155 points - 20 Dark Elf Warriors w/shields
- Full Command
A good unit that reliably adds combat res.

100 points - 10 Repeater Crossbows

100 points - 10 Repeater Crossbows
It would be worthwhile finding the points to add shields to this unit, to allow them flexibility when charged by weak enemy units.

90 points - 5 Dark Riders w/shields
Either swap the shields for a musician or beef up the unit, because at the moment these guys aren't fast cavalry, or heavy cavalry, and will struggle to accomplish anything.

55 points - 5 Harpies

55 points - 5 Harpies
Good.

50 points - 5 Witch Elves

50 points - 5 Witch Elves
Find the points to beef up the units, or try combining them. Otherwise they'll be shot to pieces with ease.

Special:

135 points - 5 Cold One Knights
I normally add full command, but would remove it to save points. This unit is fine.

60 points - 5 Executioners
Again, this unit needs enlarging to become useful. If you do buy the standard of Hag Graef then these should stay with your battle standard bearer.

Rare:

100 points - Repeater Bolt Thrower

175 points - Hydra
Both fine.
============================

2k points.

Now here's the thing, when I last played Warhammer there were no dispell dice or anything like that, magic worked differently. Plus you had stats like Intelligence and cool, so it's been a while. I've done some research and people mentioned a dispell scroll caddie which is what I've aimed for. Is my anti-magic setup above good enough, overkill, inefficient?

I'd also like some opinions on the list in general. Where should I change it?

[Iskiab]

OK, so I'm going to make some changes and here's the revised listing. Let me know what you think:

Here's my list:

350 points - Crone Hellebron


225 points - Death Hag with CoB
Battle Standard

Try adding either the Rune of Khaine or the standard of Hag Graef, to add killing power.

I'm a fan of the standard of Hag Graef, especially when combined with witch elves or lots of attacks and weak defense, but combine it with my CoB? CoB's as I understand them, can't charge because they're war machines. If so it's best left behind my line. Am I missing something?

150 points - Sorceress - lvl 2
- 2 dispell scrolls

I would consider dropping one sorceress. 4 dispel dice are not much better than 3 in my experience, and opponents tend to get upset when facing more than 2 scrolls.

Done and upgraded the sorceress to a level 2, that way she knows 2 spells.

Core:

155 points - 20 Dark Elf Warriors w/shields
- Full Command

100 points - 10 Repeater Crossbows

100 points - 10 Repeater Crossbows

It would be worthwhile finding the points to add shields to this unit, to allow them flexibility when charged by weak enemy units.

Do you think shields will help a lot? I'm thinking they'll die regardless if they're charged by anything more then skirmishers/scouts, and no one would be dumb enough to throw away scout units like that. Is it personal preference or widely held belief?

85 points - 5 Dark Riders

Either swap the shields for a musician or beef up the unit, because at the moment these guys aren't fast cavalry, or heavy cavalry, and will struggle to accomplish anything.

Done.

55 points - 5 Harpies

55 points - 5 Harpies
Good.

80 points - 8 Witch Elves

80 points - 8 Witch Elves

Find the points to beef up the units, or try combining them. Otherwise they'll be shot to pieces with ease.

Special:

135 points - 5 Cold One Knights
normally add full command, but would remove it to save points. This unit is fine.

120 points - 10 Executioners

Again, this unit needs enlarging to become useful. If you do buy the standard of Hag Graef then these should stay with your battle standard bearer.

Done.

Rare:

100 points - Repeater Bolt Thrower

175 points - Hydra
Both fine.
============================

2k points.

Now after these changes is the list good? Knowing 2 spells is better then knowing 1 imo so I can use the spell Power of Darkness every turn.

It sounds like you're suggesting to split up my army standard and CoB. The only thing is I'd need another hero. I'll have to think about a way to squeeze that in. I'd also like to fit in an assassin if possible.

[Pokatchu]

hi again

list look better now
there is the few change i would make to improve it
again : just my 2 cent!!

remove the lvl2 on mage
remove 1 unit of crosbowmen
join the unit of wichelves making them 15!

whit the point free: add a death hag whit BSB and ASF
if you need a few more point you can cut a few spearelves!
add a champ to COK unit and add ring of hotek (dest magic deffence item ever!!!)

whit that change, i think you till have a good list! and less unit to deploy mean more chance you finish first thus giving you +1 to the roll to see who get first turn!

good luck!

[Iskiab]

Oh, I made another thread to track the changes. I'll close this thread.

http://www.druchii.net/viewtopic.php?t=57255

Is my updated list.