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A few questions about a fun, yet competitive 2000 point list 
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Trainee Warrior

Joined: Tue Dec 30, 2008 7:13 pm
Posts: 30
My intention when playing Warhammer, like most people's, is to have fun. A large part of my enjoyment comes from executing devious strategies and slaughtering my foes, but I have no desire to create a cheesy list that will win the exact same way every time. I like to have to think on my feet, and to be suprised on occasion. On the other hand, being stomped on is no fun either, and though I don't mind losing (as long as I throw a few monkey wrenches into my opponent's plans!) I'd like to be competitive at the local tournaments I plan on attending.

So, with this in mind, I made the following list. It's an MSU army, without a doubt - a lot of nasty units that are fragile on their own but, if used in concert, can rip an army apart. I still have a few questions about it, though, and would greatly appreciate your advice and input.

Caliban Karakh Mavael, Thrall of the Kraken and Captain of The Tempest
Master, Manticore, Heavy Armor, Sea Dragon Cloak, Lance, Shield, Ring of Darkness - 334
Caliban will hopefully be a nightmare for enemy missile troops, rampaging around behind enemy lines, tearing gunlines to shreds, roaring very loudly, drawing fire away from the Hydra, and generally making a nuisance of himself. The Ring of Darkness will hopefully compensate for the Manticore's lack of armor, and will also help him in combat. Speaking of combat, he'll also be there for getting rear charges on troublesome units and breaking them with Terror.

Mirai Prospera Sycorax, Witch of the Serpent Sea
Supreme Sorceress, Level 4, The Hydra's Teeth, Darkstar Cloak - 325

Because Dark Elf magic is terrifying, because The Hydra's Teeth combined with the Corsair's handbows could decimate a low-toughness unit, because I've thought of a good conversion for her, and because I've written her into the army's fluff.

Assassin, Additional Hand Weapon, Rune of Khaine, Manbane - 146
He will hide in the Black Guard to increase their killing power against units that charge them, in the Shades to act as a Warmachine/Missile troop killer and for extra bite if they charge something, or in the Corsairs as another nasty surprise should they be charged. Plus, it's a nice bit of psychological warfare.

10 Corsairs (with Prospera), Handbows, Reaver with Pair of Handbows - 113
This is intended to be a "Gunfighter" unit, guarding flanks, annoying units it get close enough to with their rain of 22 bolts (fielded 10x1), lobbing spells around, taking care of light cavalry, softening up units or damaging ones I don't want to charge yet, and acting as a bodyguard for the sorceress (mage hunters will think twice about wading through two waves of 20+ pointy death sticks). Plus, you know, Pirates are awesome.

5 Harpies - 55
The role of the harpies is pretty simple - they're there for warmachine/lone mage hunting and march-blocking, or as a screen/ sacrificial unit. I also plan on converting them to be far more frightening than they have any right to be.

7 Shades, Great Weapons - 126
These can be very nasty against small units, or can get lend a helping serrated blade to combats that need it, even getting in a rear charge with a bit of luck. They, too, can double as warmachine/missile hunters, march-blockers, and charge baiters.

7 Cold One Knights, Standard Bearer with Standard of Slaughter - 240
Om nom nom. That is the noise that Cold Ones make on a charge. They are my hammer unit, and are there to get flanking charges and tear things apart. Plus, I go all fluttery for the new models.

14 Black Guard, Standard Bearer with Banner of Hag Graef - 245
The Black Guard are my anvil, who will be able to receive charges and, with the ASF banner, hopefully not get hurt much themselves. They have a pretty poor save, but can be screened by the Corsairs and harpies if necessary, and besides, with so many other big, scary things to shoot at, I doubt anyone'll pay them much attention (until they start killing everything).

2 Reaper Bolt Throwers - 200
For taking care of high toughness, high armor models and whittling down enemy infantry (along with the Corsairs).

War Hydra - 175
Since I absolutely loathe the new model, I'm planning on converting a Hydra from the bottom half of a Dragon Ogre Shaggoth, five Cold One heads, and a bunch of Green Stuff. If all goes according to plan, this will make for a very scary model on the tabletop. It's my other hammer, and can do an obscene amount of damage on a charge, particularly when combined with the BG, Shades, CoKs, or the Manticore.

Total: 1998


So, there you have it. It's a very fragile list, I know, but in some ways I think that's a perk, as it means I will never be certain of the outcome and will have to be very careful with my units. My strategy will essentially be to isolate and destroy units with combined charges. The big, scary monsters will draw fire away from my squishier infantry units, and can still be nightmares in combat. It's a razor blade, basically - very fragile but capable of doing immense damage if used correctly, which is how Druchii should roll, IMO.

So. Questions. I have some.

Should I drop the Manticore? I love him, but putting the Lord in a Cold One Chariot could allow for more infantry or for some Dark Riders. Infantry would mean less chance of total disaster if I make a mistake and more SCR, while Dark Riders would give me more things to flank with. Both are quite tempting, but I do love my big, scary Manticore and I'm not sure how effective a CoC would be.

Will this small unit size thing I've got going on have a snowball's chance in hell of working? I essentially have no SCR whatsoever, and am relying on fear, Terror, standards, combined arms, and pure killiness to break enemy units. Also, if I got a brick of warriors, I could put Prospera in them for the purpose of slaughtering them all with a Sacrificial Dagger, which is always nice.

Do I have enough magic? A level 4 is pretty substantial, but will it be enough to have an effective magic phase?

Finally, a couple of modeling questions (which I know aren't technically supposed to be asked here, but they are tangentially related to the gaming aspect). I'm planning on making the "Manticore" out of a Carnosaur with wings. I'd use a dragon instead, but I simply don't have the points and don't much like the GW Manticore model, but adore the Carnosaur. If you were playing against me, and I fielded something that looked (for all intents and purposes) very much like a dragon, but said it was a Manticore, would you be annoyed? Also, the Shaggoth hindquarters are very cool, but have those skinny, almost atrophied front limbs and studded leather. Would you believe the front limbs could support any weight? If not, can you think of a pair of limbs I could graft on in their place? Also, should I leave the cloth on? Would it end up looking terrible if I tried to remove it? Could I sculpt over it with green stuff? Heck, will the Dragon Ogre even fit on the Hydra base?

Tue Jan 06, 2009 3:33 am
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Joined: Tue Oct 09, 2007 2:15 pm
Posts: 64
Location: France
You only have one core unit (corsairs) instead of 3 required, I think.
A Full Command on your Cold one unit should be usefull.

Tue Jan 06, 2009 8:34 am
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