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New DE player needing help from the Dreadlords 
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Slave on the Altar

Joined: Fri Feb 13, 2015 8:12 am
Posts: 8
Hey guys,

Thank you for checking out my post,

A brief intro after playing my dwarves for a while now I wanted something different that would be an opposite to my typical dwarf list (I play a heavy shooty defensive list with a 30 man armour piercing crossbow unit that reroll misses) and when I do get into combat I tend to rely on taking that punch first and then hammer them down.

With my dark elves I wanted my list to be as opposing to my typical dwarves I play, the key points I want to address are -

Dwarves / Dark Elves
No Magic / Heavy magic
Very Slow / Very Fast
Defensive / Offensive
Static defense / Taking the fight to them
Shooty orientated / CC orientated
Full of warmachines / no warmachines

With this goals in mind I created this 2500pts list... I actually did a frenzy buy and now have them all in a month (sold off all my 40k stuff can't be bothered with 40k anymore)

My theme is around a black ark raiding force lead by Morathi herself, the army is a vanguard army so majority of the units are fast moving so no war machines. No time to pack and unpack :P


Lords
Morathi


Heroes
Master
Battle Standard Bearer, Cold One, Great Weapon, Heavy Armor, Sea Dragon Cloak, Shield
Magic standard - Razor Standard

Sorceress
Dark Steed, Wizard Level 1
Lore of Beasts - Wyssan's Wildform
Magic Items - Dispel Scroll, Charmed Shield, Gambler's Armour


Core
29x Black ark Corsairs - Full command
29x Additional hand weapons
Magic standard - Gleaming Pennant

5x Dark Riders
5x Repeater Crossbows, 5x Shield

5x Dark Riders
5x Repeater Crossbows, 5x Shield

10x Darkshards

10x Darkshards


Special
1x Cold One Chariot

7x Cold One Knights - Full command

20x Executioners of Har Ganeth - Full command
Magic standard - Banner of Eternal Flame


Rare
9x Doomfire Warlocks

1x Kharibdyss


The Level 1 sorcerer will be with the Doomfire Warlocks as her bunker. With Morathi around I hope the opponent spends their power dice dispelling the "big spells" before I cast Wyssan's Wildform on the doomfire warlocks and hopefully If all goes well they will cast soul blight as well. With their fast calvary status I hope to get them to the flanks before charging in buffed to T5 S5 with the opponent at T -1 S -1 adding to their number of attacks I hope I can break the enemy, in a charge with another unit.

The whole army is also divided to two -

- the first wave will be the warlocks, riders, knights, and chariot.
- the second wave will be a horde of corsairs, Kharibdyss, executioners, and the dark shards which will be used to weaken flankers before my riders finish them off. And for basic range support.


So what do you guys think? Is it a decent list to field vs against all armies... I rarely change my lists too much once I set them down. So this list building is kinda vital I get it right.


Wed Mar 04, 2015 10:16 am
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Malekith's Personal Guard
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Well I do like the list concept, but I think you're missing one of our best units for the type of list you say you want. You need a master on a dark pegasus They pack a ton of punch and can go wherever they are needed.

I love the Lvl2 Beast sorceress, Wildform is great on making core troops fight like elites, and if your opponent spends dice to dispel that, they're making Morathi's day a lot easier.

Also, you say you don't want to do shooting, yet you have 2 blocks of crossbows. I'd spend those darkshard points on witch elves for more punch in close combat, and cut down on the warlocks in favor of a pegasus master. 5 warlocks is plenty. Also 29 corsairs is a bit of overkill, no reason to have more than 24. That frees up more points for more witches.

Finally, the Kharibdyss...they are best at dealing with big, high toughness, high armor bad guys...but so are your Cold ones and your Executioners. I don't think he's necessary. If you want a monster, you might be better with a Hydra. Otherwise you could ditch him entirely for a 2nd unit of warlocks.

Just some thoughts.

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Wed Mar 04, 2015 11:13 am
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Miscast into the Warp
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A quick addition to Direweasel's comments.

Looking at your list it seems as if you are looking to add your BSB to your COK's. I would suggest if you want the razor banner then you would be better served adding it to the unit standard bearer. That would then give you the option of detaching the BSB master to go off solo if you felt the need, without impacting the COK's by removing this buff if he left the unit.

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Wed Mar 04, 2015 11:25 am
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Executioner

Joined: Wed Feb 06, 2008 3:02 pm
Posts: 167
Location: Stalking the Frozen Lands of Finland
Welcome to the forums! I see you have been able to make out quite nice and versatile list for the starters. Some thoughts though:

Note that sorceresses cannot have magic armour of any sort. And now you have even two of them on her. But dont worry, if you play her right, she should need them anyway. I would spend those points to protect your BSB, and put Razor on CoK standard bearer, as said by Amboadine. You might want to mount your BSB on dark steed too. You can still get 1+ armour for him, but it gives much more option movementwise.

You got quite a lot of magic. You mught be starved for dice even if Morathi can cast with low amount of dice spent.

I must advice you to include RBT into some of your lists too, even if they are war machines. They a lot against big fliers and armoured units that hurt DE badly. Combine it with flaming RXBs and you have nice way of dealing with regen monsters before they hurt you.

You might think about this kind "wave" offence due previous exoerience with dwarves. However, DE units work best when synergized with each other. You should keep your units together, because single units of elves are pretty easy to kill due to low toughness and numbers. You should keep BSB near your infantry blocks too. if you mount your BSB on DS you can put him into warlocks and maybe hang between CoKs and infantry blocks. Having your BSB on a pegasus would allow him to be anywhere you want him to be. so if you can get points for pegasus, it would be great.

Instead of head-on wave assault I suggest you use kind of sweeping wave tactic. For example, deploy your army like this (from left to right or other way around):
1. Shooting units and chariot 2. Infantry blocks 3. Fast and hitty elements like DR, CoKs, kharib.

Use your superior movement and combat ability to crush the enemy flank early game, while draving enemy towards your shooting units and combat blocks. In the mid-late game refirm your fast units and flank the enemy.
This deployment can be used offensively too. Then advance with everything you got and screen your important units with expendable ones (DR and darkshards)


Last edited by Ajattaro on Wed Mar 04, 2015 12:36 pm, edited 2 times in total.



Wed Mar 04, 2015 11:53 am
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Corsair
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Give DR musicians. Rally after feign fleeing is unvaluable.
Give darkshards (assuming you keep them) musicians. Ability to rearrange AND shoot is very important. And see how shields would fit, 5+6++ is nice.

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Wed Mar 04, 2015 12:02 pm
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Slave on the Altar

Joined: Fri Feb 13, 2015 8:12 am
Posts: 8
Thank you for your kind inputs, yes the list is partly got to do with maximising what i have bought. I actually feel like dropping the darkshards too just that I need to figure out what to replace them with.

Is the cauldron of bood a must for witches?

Yea i wanted to add bolt throwers but i really wanted to try playing without them. Are they a must have in your experience?

Also apologies on the magic armour bit DE is my second army i am too used to dwarves and our Rune system


Wed Mar 04, 2015 4:11 pm
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Malekith's Personal Guard
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paxter wrote:
Is the cauldron of bood a must for witches?


Not a must, but it definitely makes them better. It basically comes down to whether you want the witches to be a large point sink or not. If you're willing to spend that many points on the unit, it is pretty potent.

paxter wrote:
Yea i wanted to add bolt throwers but i really wanted to try playing without them. Are they a must have in your experience?


They are good, I field them pretty often. But I didn't mention them because you specified no war machines. I would also say that if you are going to go with bolt throwers, getting just one is a waste of time and effort, they work in bulk. Bottom line is this, in my opinion: Are they "must have"? No. Are they good? Yes. One of the really cool things about Dark Elves is that they have several different viable ways to build a good force.

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Chinese Relativity Axiom: No matter how glorious your triumphs, nor how miserable your failures, there will always be at least one billion people in China who don't give a damn.

Apocalypse Drow! Plog: http://druchii.net/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=75360


Wed Mar 04, 2015 4:21 pm
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Corsair
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paxter wrote:
Dwarves / Dark Elves
Full of warmachines / no warmachines
Shooty orientated / CC orientated
Defensive / Offensive
Static defense / Taking the fight to them
Very Slow / Very Fast
No Magic / Heavy magic
You might want to add:
Code:
No chariot / 4 Chariots
No monsters / 4 Monsters
No psychology / Psycho bombs
No assassins / Assassins
Zillion of rune combos / Magic items, poisons, Khaine's blessings

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Wed Mar 04, 2015 5:08 pm
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Slave on the Altar

Joined: Fri Feb 13, 2015 8:12 am
Posts: 8
Pardon my noobness but what qualifies as a Psycho bomb?


Thu Mar 05, 2015 5:41 am
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Aspiring Brush Master
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Joined: Mon Apr 30, 2007 9:19 pm
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Location: In my Armory, protecting my Weed.
Its a tactic which evolves around the use of Shroud of Darkness. which removes the BSB rerolls for Ld aswell as a Generals Inspiring Presence. Then whenever units affected by this spell Every Unit affect by it has there Ld reduced by 1.
Its a bastard of a tactic which (when played right with enough Fear/Terror/Panic/Reforms/ect) you can reduce their Ld to a pathetic value.

And since it targets thr enemies Psychology its called Psychobombing ;)

((hope I explained that right))

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Group 41- Name: Searinox Nagharha - Shade
WS:5 S:3 T:3 D:4 I:4
Equipment: Long sword; Falchion (family heirloom), Very Good Sabre, Short sword, Dagger, Throwing Dagger (4) SeaDragon Cloak, Chain
Inventory: 30 gold (214 still to be paid), Silver Bracelet, several flagons: 1x Strength potion, 3x Courage potion, 3x Healing Potion.
Skills: Two Weapon Fighting, Acrobatics, Basic Stealth


Thu Mar 05, 2015 6:19 am
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Corsair
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I meant by psycho bombs
- the idea to cause many, many tests, with the help of terror (monsters, large chariots), fear (CO, medusas, cry of war),
which is already sufficient against low Ld armies,
- added with psy modifiers: shroud of despair (Dark Lore), Shrine and Kharibdyss,
to help against high Ld armies.

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Winds never stop blowing, Oceans are borderless. Get a ship and a crew, so the World will be ours! Today the World, tomorrow Nagg! {--|oBrotherhood of the Coast!o|--}


Thu Mar 05, 2015 6:52 am
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Slave on the Altar

Joined: Fri Feb 13, 2015 8:12 am
Posts: 8
Was trying to see if I can fit a decent list with what I have, I took some pointers from everyone and tried to revamp my list. I also realize I have a Skaryaa, the Blood Mistress model and an assassin from my bloodbowl team.

Do you think this list is playable and I can face most armies with a decent level of success?

I am still keeping to the Vanguard theme for my Black ark army. The x30 Corsairs will now have a death hag and a level 1 beast mage in it. And if someone tries to take them on the assassin will pop out to deal with it (hopefully)

Noob question
If they challenge my character can the assassin step in?



Lords
Morathi


Heroes
Death Hag
Fencer's Blades, Witchbrew

Khainite Assassin
Black Lotus, Potion of Strength, Sword of Battle

Master
Battle Standard Bearer, Dark Pegasus, Heavy Armor, Sea Dragon Cloak, Charmed Shield, Sword of Might

Sorceress
Lore of Beasts, Wizard Level 1 - Dispel Scroll


Core
30x Blackark Corsairs
Full Command - Additional hand weapons, Gleaming Pennant

5x Dark Riders
Musician - Repeater Crossbows, Shield

5x Dark Riders
Musician - Repeater Crossbows, Shield

12x Darkshards
Shield


Special
1x Cold One Chariot

8x Cold One Knights
Full Command - Banner of Eternal Flame


Rare
10x Doomfire Warlocks

1x Kharibdyss


Thu Mar 05, 2015 8:06 am
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Corsair
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Joined: Fri Mar 14, 2008 10:00 pm
Posts: 8741
Location: Hag Graef
DE is not that easy to master.
You will find out that they are very fragile, they die in droves to a feeble breeze of shooting.
As you pointed at, they are tremendously different from Dwarfs, and you will have a ong learning curve.

About 'sass, yes they can answer challenges... provided they have been revealed. It can be done at the start of the CC phase, i.e. before challenges are issued.

Death Hag - Fencer's Blades, Witchbrew
I like the blades, it helps her survive in melee. Be aware that she loses her poison.

30x Blackark Corsairs - that might be a little bit too many, if you need pts, you can consider taking 25, that should suffice in most situations.

12x Darkshards: take a musician, in case you wish them to shoot at a target behind them or on flanks. A musician is necessary to shoot after rearranging.

10 locks: That many might not be necessary.

Oveerall, that makes a good army in the hands of a proficient player.

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Winds never stop blowing, Oceans are borderless. Get a ship and a crew, so the World will be ours! Today the World, tomorrow Nagg! {--|oBrotherhood of the Coast!o|--}


Thu Mar 05, 2015 10:40 am
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Malekith's Personal Guard
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I think you'll have more flexibility with 2 units of 5 warlocks, as opposed to the block of 10. Otherwise it's markedly better than the previous list.

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Chinese Relativity Axiom: No matter how glorious your triumphs, nor how miserable your failures, there will always be at least one billion people in China who don't give a damn.

Apocalypse Drow! Plog: http://druchii.net/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=75360


Thu Mar 05, 2015 11:37 am
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Aspiring Brush Master
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One question about your Assassin. why the Sword of Battle? The Assassin can be equiped with an Additional Hand Weapon which does exactly the same for a fraction of the points. the only thing you gain is Magical Attacks.

Also keep in mind thar the Potion of Strength can only be taken at the start of a player turn. not at the start of a CC phase.

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Group 41- Name: Searinox Nagharha - Shade
WS:5 S:3 T:3 D:4 I:4
Equipment: Long sword; Falchion (family heirloom), Very Good Sabre, Short sword, Dagger, Throwing Dagger (4) SeaDragon Cloak, Chain
Inventory: 30 gold (214 still to be paid), Silver Bracelet, several flagons: 1x Strength potion, 3x Courage potion, 3x Healing Potion.
Skills: Two Weapon Fighting, Acrobatics, Basic Stealth


Thu Mar 05, 2015 4:10 pm
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Malekith's Personal Guard
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Location: Terre Haute, IN, USA
It's actually worse, since you can't put poison on magical weapons. Nice catch.

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Chinese Relativity Axiom: No matter how glorious your triumphs, nor how miserable your failures, there will always be at least one billion people in China who don't give a damn.

Apocalypse Drow! Plog: http://druchii.net/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=75360


Thu Mar 05, 2015 5:55 pm
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