So I've been playing this list for about 6 months now with really good success. I have a big time GT coming up in July that I'm hoping to be highly competitive for. The tournament is a Swedish Comp based tournament and this one comes in at a clip of 8.7 so it's considered band 2(medium level). I just was curious as to what everyones outside opinions were and if you guys can see any glaring weakness besides the low unit count. Thanks A lot in advance!
Lords
lvl 4 Life wizard-sac dagger, talisman of endurance(obviously bunkered in spearmen)
Heroes
Death Hag-Cauldron of blood, Witchbrew, BSB upgrade, Sword of anti-heroes(goes in unit of executioners)
Death Hag-Cauldron of blood, cry of war, obsidian blade(goes with witches to help off set 1+/2+ armor saves)
Lvl 2 Dark sorceress-dark steed, dispel scroll(joins dark riders and with PoD she can make them str 5 on the charge
Master on Peg-Cloak of Twilight, repeater crossbow, full mundane, lance(Does anyone build lists without these anymore lol)
Core
28 Witch Elves, FC, Razor Standard( Amazed more and more everyday with this unit)
9 Dark riders, Musician, Standard Bearer, Shields, RC(Between these guys and the peg master I am able to offset low number chaff armies, high number could be an issue but I haven't ran into them yet)
19 Dreadspears, Musician, Standard Bearer, Standard of Discipline(ld 10 bubble is just great)
Special
28 Executioners, FC, Banner of Swiftness(plus one movement makes these guys a pretty formidable unit in terms of maneuverability)
2498 total
New 2500 hammer list
Moderator: The Dread Knights
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Alex_romano
- Slave (off the Altar)
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- Joined: Sat Mar 10, 2012 5:59 pm
- Location: Newark Ohio
Re: New 2500 hammer list
It looks very good to me, but a couple of questions/comments.
- Do you find that your magic is overkill? Two mages at 2,500 seems a lot to me. Could you make do with just one (the level 4 maybe?). If you really want the second, you could change those dark riders into warlocks possibly.
- Do you really need the Cauldron of Blood in the the executioners? It seems like a lot of points for relatively little value. Yes, you get a 6+ ward and the chance to re-roll failed to wound rolls, but you already re-roll all failed to-wound rolls of a 1, which is very often the equivalent of a re-roll failed to wound rolls for executioners with their S6, and a 6+ ward save is barely game changing. Yes, adding in the witch brew gives the unit frenzy (with the potential for superfrenzy if you get the bound spell off - but that spell is already competing for power dice with two wizards and a +0 to cast bonus makes it very easy for an opposing mage to dispel), but again, you could get this same effect from other sources. Same goes for the MR2 it provides, which could easily be supplied by a master with a MR3 magic item for cheaper if desired. Personally, I would think you would get a better deal out of just buying more executioners than taking the Cauldron.
- The dreadspear unit seems small to me: just 19 means that if the unit gets charged, they can easily be destroyed and your SS general eradicated. I'd try to add a bit more bulk if you can.
- You lack small size support troops. Units like chariots, hydras, and K-beasts can add a lot of combat res to a combat that is in the balance very nicely. They have a small frontage and are very maneuverable, and don't cost that much, but can easily add on 3 or 4 or more points of combat res through combi charges or counter-charges.
- You have limited shooting (except magic missiles, the Dark Riders and the single RxB on the Master). That leaves you a bit vulnerable to armies that dance around and avoid direct combat while peppering you to death (aka "Death by a thousand paper cuts").
All minor comments, but you asked for feedback and hopefully that will give you some things to consider, even if you reject them all ultimately
- Do you find that your magic is overkill? Two mages at 2,500 seems a lot to me. Could you make do with just one (the level 4 maybe?). If you really want the second, you could change those dark riders into warlocks possibly.
- Do you really need the Cauldron of Blood in the the executioners? It seems like a lot of points for relatively little value. Yes, you get a 6+ ward and the chance to re-roll failed to wound rolls, but you already re-roll all failed to-wound rolls of a 1, which is very often the equivalent of a re-roll failed to wound rolls for executioners with their S6, and a 6+ ward save is barely game changing. Yes, adding in the witch brew gives the unit frenzy (with the potential for superfrenzy if you get the bound spell off - but that spell is already competing for power dice with two wizards and a +0 to cast bonus makes it very easy for an opposing mage to dispel), but again, you could get this same effect from other sources. Same goes for the MR2 it provides, which could easily be supplied by a master with a MR3 magic item for cheaper if desired. Personally, I would think you would get a better deal out of just buying more executioners than taking the Cauldron.
- The dreadspear unit seems small to me: just 19 means that if the unit gets charged, they can easily be destroyed and your SS general eradicated. I'd try to add a bit more bulk if you can.
- You lack small size support troops. Units like chariots, hydras, and K-beasts can add a lot of combat res to a combat that is in the balance very nicely. They have a small frontage and are very maneuverable, and don't cost that much, but can easily add on 3 or 4 or more points of combat res through combi charges or counter-charges.
- You have limited shooting (except magic missiles, the Dark Riders and the single RxB on the Master). That leaves you a bit vulnerable to armies that dance around and avoid direct combat while peppering you to death (aka "Death by a thousand paper cuts").
All minor comments, but you asked for feedback and hopefully that will give you some things to consider, even if you reject them all ultimately
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Alex_romano
- Slave (off the Altar)
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Re: New 2500 hammer list
Hey thanks for the feed back, you've brought some good points up.
I haven't had any issues with two wizards yet, its usually my normal kit out at 2500, just in case one fails a spell or something more dire happens.
I guess I haven't tried the unit of execs without the Cauldron yet to say if it works better. I might try it with just a Hag on foot.
I hate running such a small unit of spearmen especially with the sac dagger lol and may just drop the level 2 to a 1 and run more spearmen. probably be a little better off that way.
An MSU crazy shooting list is definitely a big mismatch, but luckily our local meta doesn't see too much of that. I may just have to accept if i run into that it's going to be a challenge.
again thanks for the suggestions
I haven't had any issues with two wizards yet, its usually my normal kit out at 2500, just in case one fails a spell or something more dire happens.
I guess I haven't tried the unit of execs without the Cauldron yet to say if it works better. I might try it with just a Hag on foot.
I hate running such a small unit of spearmen especially with the sac dagger lol and may just drop the level 2 to a 1 and run more spearmen. probably be a little better off that way.
An MSU crazy shooting list is definitely a big mismatch, but luckily our local meta doesn't see too much of that. I may just have to accept if i run into that it's going to be a challenge.
again thanks for the suggestions
Re: New 2500 hammer list
it is good to have a lvl 1(2) to support your main mage.
this is much more important for dispelling than for the casting, but even with casting if you have just one mage you are very dependant on the losing concetration.
exes are fine with just witchbrew imo. rerolling to wound is not that important while 6+ ward save is very dicy. I am running sorc inside as well, as I do not feel that sacrificial dagger is worth its points in the current edition,
this is much more important for dispelling than for the casting, but even with casting if you have just one mage you are very dependant on the losing concetration.
exes are fine with just witchbrew imo. rerolling to wound is not that important while 6+ ward save is very dicy. I am running sorc inside as well, as I do not feel that sacrificial dagger is worth its points in the current edition,
I like to win, but not by playing the limit of the rules