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Force Multipliers In the DE Army 
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force multiplier
(DOD) A capability that, when added to and employed by a combat force, significantly increases the combat potential of that force and thus enhances the probability of successful mission accomplishment.


I got this definition off a military doctrines website, and being in the military myself found that the definition is quite good.

So in looking at the DE army one can see a number of force multipliers that are pertinent in the game.

Lets start with a basic combat force of 2 units of spearmen or corsairs. These usually form the basis from which an army grows. They do the majority of the work in the army, provide the numbers to soak up missile casualties and the ranks to win combat resolutions. I find in my armies the humble spearman/corsair win the battles for me. The form the core around which the rest of the army is designed.

Now lets look at force multipliers. The key phrase in that definition is "significatly increase the combat potential". The word significant is very important. We are not talking about a sheild or weapon, but a force that changes the entire outcome of the battle. Yes I know the argument "if I didn't make that 6+ armour save I would have lost the combat". That was a significant RESULT of an insignificant application of force. Totally different.

I belive that the best force multipliers in the Dark Elf army are as follows.

1) DR

2) Manticore and rider

3) Fighting characters in units

Borderline units are

4) Cauldron

7) Sorceresses

I will explain my reasoning.

The DR are probably the best force multipliers in the DE army by far. They are core and can shoot or attack. The reason that DR are essential force multipliers is because of their potential to win the game for you in an assisting role. Let me elaborate. DR can charge a flank when your spearmen are fighting. This immediatly has 3 effects, the unit charged takes a panic test, the unit charges loses rank bonus and the DE gain +1 combat resolution. DR by thier own cannot do this, and spearmen on their own would essentially be dealing with a tied combat. The application of the DR to this combat causes a "significant increase in the combat potential" of the spearmen.

DR are also able to hunt down mages and warmachines and inhibit the enemy from using their own light cav in a similar manner. Killing an enemy mage significantly increases the combat potential of the entire army.

Manticores with riders do a very similar thing because of their mobility and unit strength. They also have the added advantage of causing terror. A beastmaster on a manticore may not be able to destroy a fully ranked unit by himself but as a force multiplyer he is invaluable.

Characters in units are the standard force multiplyer for many armies that do not have excellent fast cavalry. The placement of a character in a unit can completely change the results of combat due to magic items carried and shear combat ability. The resulting 3 or four extra casualties can very significantly change the fate of a simple battle between evenly matched units. Also characters have the ability to inhibit other characters from operating efficiently through challanges, thus reducing the enemies ability to force multiply.

The two borderline units are very controversial.

The CoB is essentially only designed as a force multiplier. It's entire job is to increase the efficiency of combat units. I agree that it does this job well. I do not know (at this time I'll withold judgement until Grogs finishes his statistics on casualties caused and units destroyed with the cauldrons help) whether or not the difference is significant as significance is required to be defined as a force multiplier.

Sorceresses and spells cast by them are another borderline unit. This is for a number of reasons. The first is that Dark magic is mainly a damage the enemy lore. WoP when used correctly is an excellent force multiplier as is Dominion, however the ease at which magic is dispelled and mages hunted down limits the effectiveness of the Sorceress as a force multiplier. The Shadow lore may be the best example of a lore thats entire job is to enhance the combat potential of units. The application of the spell that causes fear, limits missile casualties and unseen lurker are all excellent spells that can significantly increase a units combat potential (esp. the fear spell). But the comments on dispeling magic and killing mages are valid with this lore as well.

(EDIT for spelling and grammar)

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Last edited by Underway on Thu Nov 27, 2003 9:32 pm, edited 1 time in total.



Thu Nov 27, 2003 7:07 pm
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Overall, good analysis, Underway. One thing I'd like to throw out there is that even damage the enemy spells are *usually* force multipliers. The reason being that most damaging spells aren't going to destroy whole enemy units by themselves. This is especially true of Dark magic, due to the fact that it's relatively short ranged and requires LOS (which combined means that you'll usually not have many 'shots' with your damaging spells before combat is joined). However, what they will do is 1) strip away your opponents' 'force multipliers' (fast cav, scouts, war machines). 2) weaken enemy units in terms of unit strength, and hopefully rank bonus. In our case, it's even more noticeable, since our two real 'heavy hitter' spells have additional effects which further emphasize their role.

Steal Soul is short ranged (thus limiting the total damage potential across the battlefield) but can be cast into close combat... effectively providing additonal support to that combat, potentially lowering rank bonus, switching outnumber from them to us, or (best case) panicking the unit it hits.

Arnie's Horror is likewise, potentially very damaging, but the little 'one casualty = panic' stipulation means that again, even mild damage to several units can significantly weaken your enemy's battle line or potentially help shape the battle for you. imo, unlike most damaging effects, touching several units (just a couple models each) with arnie's template is much better than centering on just one unit (in most cases), simply because of the spread of panic tests that can result.

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Thu Nov 27, 2003 7:24 pm
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Now this is what I call a good post.

I agree with what you have said, but I'd like to add that Chariots and Hydra are also force multipliers for infantry units.

A unit of spearmen charging another unit is unlikely to break it. The combination of a spearmen charge and a chariot charge is significant. The potential to inflict an extra avg 4 S5 hits as well as the riders and cold ones can easily mean 4 extra casualties.

The hydra can do all the DR can do when it comes to a flank attack. (the hydra is also versatile in a frontal attack as well similar to the chariot) but the hydra adds something DR cannot, Terror/Fear tests. That can mean two tests taken by the said unit, one from panic and one from terror/fear. Also the hydra is generally as mobile as a chariot being able to turn at any time for free during movement.

Finally both the chariot and hydra add something else that dark riders cannot. Dark riders charging a unit of Chaos warriors (or other such strong/tough unit) on the flank is not always a "sure thing". DR are easy kills, as easy to kill as a spearman, but much more expensive. While you will negate ranks for that particular round of combat, those extra kills by the enemy may balance out. Next round your DR are not negating the ranks depending on what happened. A hydra or a chariot, however, is T5 and AS 4+. This means the unit can take a good beating and generally isn't suseptible to providing the enemy with more CR. A hydra on the flank still negates ranks and is damn hard to get rid of by even the strongest of infantry.

I think the cauldron is a force multiplier. I would like it if people liek Grog who actually design serious cauldron lists would keep detailed stats of the extra wounds and causualties the cauldron inflicts. This would be very interesting to get over a large number of games. I think it will turn out that the cauldron is very effective if used with the right units and strategies.

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Thu Nov 27, 2003 8:04 pm
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One thing I did not do is differentiate between a support unit and a force multiplier. A support units is one that backs up the main combat units and gives them a slight edge, not a significant edge.

These include,

Sorceresses
Shades
Harpies
RXB
RBT
BSB, standards and musican

The shooty units in the list (including Sorceresses) are there to remove ranks and eliminate the enemies force multipliers and support units. The removal of one rank may spell the difference between a won or lost combat but they do not directly effect the combat as it is ongoing. Panic cause by shooting is good, but rarely in most instances does it mean that the game is over. I do belive that everyone here can agree that the game is won in the combat phase, not in the shooting phase.

Shade and harpies are support because of their special abilities to kill warmachines, lone mages, block march moves, screen shooting and draw out fanatics etc... They are not able to directly effect a combat as a force multiplier but can remove/restrict the enemies ability to get to combat or support his combat units.

The BSB is obviously a support unit because it reduces the chance of breaking for your own units allowing them a second chance to win a combat, it also gives a +1 combat resolution when in combat that may just tip the balance in your favour. On a similar line the general is a support unit when not directly fighting for the same reasons.

Standards and musicians are not support units per say but they have a great enought effect to be included in the list. They both give slight advantages to the unit in combat but not usually enough to be significant.

BTW I agree for the most part about the CoC and Hydra comments, mainly due to the fact that a CoC and hydra only need a piece of the enemy unit to inflict full damage. I was thinking about putting them in there but I wanted to get at least one response to this post!! :mrgreen:

The argument now is how effective are they at their jobs?

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Thu Nov 27, 2003 9:45 pm
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I will chip in my vote for the dark riders, and add some thoughts as to why the advantage.

Charge distance: at 18 inches they move almost as fast as flying units and so can strike from positions of relative safety compared to many of the other kinds of troops mentioned.
Cost: at 90 points for bare bones if you take a few units it isn’t too critical if you lose one.
Reliability: dark riders can reach and bring combat power to places of the board that few other troops can – compared to our other cav, which may not due to stupidity or insufficient move, or magic due to the fickleness of that phase…

So if you are paying points for a desired effect: point for point dark riders work well in most situations. Harder targets though, require harder things to break them into smaller pieces….

Great thoughts, thanks!
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Fri Nov 28, 2003 12:36 am
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Some good points Underway.

I would also include the Hydra, COC and if you're going to include the Manticore, then you also have to include the Dragon, since it does everything the Manticore does along with a breath weapon and with an armor save. I would also include the RBT, though maybe that's because I'm a little unclear on the distinction between Support Unit and Force Multiplier (more on that in a moment).

The Assassin may be one of the most versitile Force Multipliers that we have in the way of Characters. He can be a very good mage hunter, an excellent rank and file killer, keeping Executioners alive after the initial charge round, and is capable of killing a good number of enemy characters (thus eliminating opponent's Force Multipliers).

One thing, can you clear up a little where you are drawing the distinction between Support Unit and Force Multiplier? It seems to me like a pretty fine line, and I'd like to get a better understanding as to where you draw the distinction.

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Fri Nov 28, 2003 4:09 am
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Icon Hack wrote:


One thing, can you clear up a little where you are drawing the distinction between Support Unit and Force Multiplier? It seems to me like a pretty fine line, and I'd like to get a better understanding as to where you draw the distinction.


It's a little easier to draw a distinction in the real world between force multipliers and support units. Force multipliers are things like attack helicopters, A10 Warthogs and in the navy (my specialty) submarines. These elements by themselves can significantly tip a battle one way or the other, as they cannot normally do the job themselves, but when combined with Tanks, infantry and in the navies case, a Task Group.

Support units are things like artillery, supply trucks, fleet oilers, antiair emplacements etc... These things are there to protect, supply or do a very specific job in the combat organization. Often it is to reduce the impact of enemy force multipliers or ensure that the troops are supplied fed and their equipment is in a good condition to fight.

In the warhammer world you can classify based on I belive two simple criteria.

1) Can the unit win direct combat on its own in a straight up fight with a standard enemy unit (ie: spearmen vs clanrats, Orcs, dwarven warriors etc)?

2) Can the unit significantly tip the balance in combat so that a straight up fight becomes a rout?

This will seperate the units into three catagories.

Those that meet criteria one are considered basic combat units (BCU). This is mainly all the rank and file of the Druchii list and the CoK.

Those that meet criteria two are considered force multipliers (FM). These have been discussed in the previous post.

Those that do not meet these two criteria are considered support units. They either have a very specific job or are not effective enough in the FM catagory.

Now where things get fuzzy is the argument that RBT (for example) are force multipliers. Everyone will say "I had a battle the other day and my RBT killed 27 Chaos warriors, that surely qualifies them." Well no it doesn't. Can RBT engage and destroy the enemy in direct combat? If those chaos knights charged the RBT would they survive? No they wouldn't. Artillery is classified in the real world as a support unit because they cannot do the job alone in most cases.

Also the casualties caused by one artillery gun (and one RBT unit) is not significant enough to change the entire course of the battle unless there is a luck shot. An attack helicopter on the other hand can hover in a battle zone and immediatly remove hard targets so the armour and infantry can win the battle. DR can do the same, turning a tied combat into a full scale rout to the enemies combat units. RBT just don't have that capacity. What they do have is a capacity to atrit the enemy to the point where they are not able to be effective in combat, or eliminate enemy FM, but that is not part of our definition as a force multiplier.

So therefore classified as a support unit.

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Fri Nov 28, 2003 3:25 pm
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Much clearer now, yes. Thanks for the greater detail. In this respect then I do see why RBT's are classified as support.

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Fri Nov 28, 2003 4:23 pm
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Maybe there are too many shooty armies here in Italy - my DR's rarely achieve anything. They get a really good wrap here in Druchii.net but I'm not so keen on them.
By the way if i was to nominate a force intensifier ... or whatever ... i would say the Hydra Banner.


Fri Nov 28, 2003 5:20 pm
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Quote:
So you're a Bubblehead, huh?


Does that mean civil servant? Cause if it does no. I'm a contract worker (biologist) and military officer.

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Fri Nov 28, 2003 6:55 pm
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Very good topic Underway!

I like your thinking here and applied in conjunction with the principle of Army Redundancy makes for a clear path in the construction of army lists. Good to see you started your analysis with Infantry units as I play around with Infantry lists quite often at present.

I think it would be good to see some sample lists based on these principles.


Fri Nov 28, 2003 7:10 pm
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Underway wrote:
Quote:
So you're a Bubblehead, huh?


Does that mean civil servant? Cause if it does no. I'm a contract worker (biologist) and military officer.


Submariners in the US navy are called Bubbleheads.


Sat Nov 29, 2003 6:26 pm
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Good topic, Underway. Thanks.


Sun Nov 30, 2003 5:59 pm
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Underway -

Nice topic. As you have said, Force Multipliers are essentially things which have an impact on the battlefield which is far in excess of their apparent value on their own. I would, however, go one step further than the two question classification criteria that you proposed - asymmetrical combat.

Essentially, this says that it is often preferable to use non-like units to engage the enemy. Perfect examples in modern warfare include aircraft vs. ground forces ... and the opposite - ground forces against aircraft on the ground. Special Operations forces are designed for assymetrical combat - they go after targets typically reserved for aircraft or other larger formations.

In Warhammer terms, we also have examples of assymmetry in action:

1. Using Cavalry to keep enemy away from advancing infantry
2. Using infantry (and its rank bonus) to protect cavalry from other infantry

All this is to say that, in the right situation, almost ANY unit can be a force multiplier if used correctly.

J


Mon Dec 01, 2003 3:20 pm
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jeffleong13 wrote:
Underway -

Nice topic. As you have said, Force Multipliers are essentially things which have an impact on the battlefield which is far in excess of their apparent value on their own. I would, however, go one step further than the two question classification criteria that you proposed - asymmetrical combat.

Essentially, this says that it is often preferable to use non-like units to engage the enemy. Perfect examples in modern warfare include aircraft vs. ground forces ... and the opposite - ground forces against aircraft on the ground. Special Operations forces are designed for assymetrical combat - they go after targets typically reserved for aircraft or other larger formations.

In Warhammer terms, we also have examples of assymmetry in action:

1. Using Cavalry to keep enemy away from advancing infantry
2. Using infantry (and its rank bonus) to protect cavalry from other infantry

All this is to say that, in the right situation, almost ANY unit can be a force multiplier if used correctly.

J



What you say is very true, especially about any unit can ba a force multiplier if used correctly. This is the entire theme behind MSU. All the units are able to be either force multipliers or main line units. The thing is MSU tactics do not allow for your core fighters to take the enemy head on. You absolutely require a force multiplier to win the battle. By making all of your units such a thing you greatly increase your chances.

I am of the school of thought (and play) that a hybrid MSU works best. Large blocks of spearmen backed up by MSU style units. I really think that you need that solid core of basic troops to really come out on top. But that may just go to my playing style.

As for assymetry, RBT are great examples, as not many things can match them in a shooting contest, and they can normally devestate things from range without getting themselves into combat.

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Mon Dec 01, 2003 5:25 pm
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jeffleong13 wrote:
All this is to say that, in the right situation, almost ANY unit can be a force multiplier if used correctly.

J


Agreed, atleast until a more precise definition of significant is put forth. A unit of 7 harpies will be a distinctive FM if engaging a slave unit in the flank, while frontal engaged by spears (assume only 10 or so spears left).

What can we use this information for then? Well we can see that any unit with this potential of being a FM can swing a battle. It is then all about putting that unit in the right situation to utilise this potential.

Many battles I fight you could say that the BCU (Basic Combat Units), do the brunt of the workload, but no BCUs will work better than their FMs.
So a conclusion will be that both are needed.

I am actualy of the opinion that the battle is won, not by your BCUs but actualy by your FMs. Put in another way if you can somehow manage to eliminate the opponents FMs in the early stages while preserving your own FMs, the later part of the battle should be easy to handle.

This is where the Support Units (SU), fits in. The job support units should do is to threaten or dispose of enemy FMs. RBT are very good at this job, their relative small amount of damage if used against BCU will suddenly become quite significant damage if used against FMs (Especialy fast cavalry, light chariots, multiple wound creatures, and to a lesser degree skirmishers). The excelent range and reliability of the RBT, means that centraly deployed it will be able to support both flanks against enemy FMs.

The DR then fall into a mix of the two categorys. They have the ability to act both as a FM and a SU (This is the reason they are regarded with so high esteme). In the initial phases of the game they are excelent at harrasing the smaller FMs and combined with the RBT it means that they can clear a flank quickly and efficiently.

Above is probably a perfect example of how a SU and a FM cooperates, to give the FM a possibility of helping the BCU later in the game.

The battle is won between the SUs enhancing your own FM, or canceling the opponents FM.


Asger

PS I have one category that hasn't been addresed, that is the ECU (Elite Combat Unit). This I would clasify as units such as Chaos Knights or Black Knights. Basicaly this is a unit that don't need to have the aid of a FM to make a combat become significant, and it has the movement which means it won't be ignored or picked of by SU.
The best strategy against ECU is probably to leave out the BCU and hit it with several FMs.

PPS Nice thread


Mon Dec 01, 2003 6:18 pm
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Well Asger, while I agree with most of your points, I must say that you don't need a FM to win the battle.

Essentially try this list. All FM. Can you win? Not really.

Try this list. A BCU. Can you win? Yes, you can.

Why? Because of the point that Jefflong brought up in that any unit can be a force multiplier. But what he left out is that most force multipliers (with the exception of the Hydra and sometime the Chariots) cannot be used as a BCU. There you have the distinction.


Quote:
Special Operations forces are designed for assymetrical combat - they go after targets typically reserved for aircraft or other larger formations


I tend to look at harpies and shades as these guys. Can you just see a harpy wearing a ballaclava and carrying a MK10, only to use it as a club? !lol!

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Mon Dec 01, 2003 6:29 pm
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Here's another "force multiplier" in the DE list --

The Hydra Banner

Adding additonal attacks to an already strong combat unit seems to fit the description right on.

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Mon Dec 01, 2003 7:02 pm
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Wow, a true tactical discussion on the "Tactics Forum"....who woulda thunk it.

I'm generally in agreement with the classifications of the troops here so far, but I think it may be a little oversimplified for the game of Warhammer. One of the distinctions that we're making here is whether or not the unit can win a fight on its own (or with support), but we're not looking at what kind of support it is. I feel that a couple of turns of shooting from a RBT is much more effective against rank and file units than a flank charge from a Manticore or Dark Riders. The Combat Resolution may not be directly affected, but there are signifcant indirect results that we get out of it. Not only do you "soften" the enemy unit up, but you remove casualties before the combat even takes place, thereby putting doubts in your opponent's mind of whether or not the unit should go into combat at all. So, how exactly does the unit of 5 DR become more of a Force Multiplier than a Reaper Bolt Thrower? I'd say the RBTs and RXBs have much more of an effect on the outcome of the game than a "support" role, and, in fact, I have seen several armies that take advantage of these as their only Force Multipliers.....you don't need to worry about your Tank Battallion when you've already carpet bombed the entire enemy force.

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Mon Dec 01, 2003 7:58 pm
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Wow. . . so this is what happens when I go away for the TG weekend! Excellent post Underway, and most excellent replies from just about everyone else. I have two cents to offer regarding 'borderline' FMs:

A single RBT, 12 XBows, and a low-level sorceress w/ death magic (in my experience) has proved to be a great FM tag-team. For just over 300 pts, you get three units that when working together can eliminate fast targets that the block units cannot effectively chase down. In addition, once these fast targets are eliminated, they can switch to softening the hard targets to enable your main units and force multipliers (ie, FLANKERS) to win the day. By distributing the shooting power, the tag-team is more resistant to casualties.

As an aside, the low sorceress is very reliable with her magic missile b/c of her +1 to cast, and my opponent saving his dispel dice for my other sorceress. So I get a near-consistent d6 S4 hits to supplement the shooting of the Xbows, Rxbows, and reaper.

Anyway, I think that the flee & flank strategy of MSU hybrid demonstrates the concept of force multipliers. My spears provide the ranks, my corsairs or draichs (w/ noble of course) provide the kills while negating your ranks. The shooting tag-team is a force multiplier in the sense that 1) it directly whittles the enemy block, making him more susceptible to rout and 2) thinking outside the box, it easily clears away the opposing support units which indirectly helps you rout the main units b/c they have no flank coverage.

An example of this is my latest game against bretonnians: I used the shooting elements to totally kill his fast cav in the first turn (no blessing for peasants). Now he has nothing to screen his knights. His two infantry blocks (which were covering the sides of the lances to prevent my riders from hampering the knights) were then panicked off the table with concentrated shooting/magic. By turn 3, his remaining 4 lances were in the center of the board, with two units of riders behind them, and draichs and corsairs and spears all set for massive combined charges.

It is the combined charge that makes the spear unit + corsair unit + noble stronger than the sum of the parts, so FM is in effect. But it was the shooty/magic tag-team that enabled that situation to be possible. If I'd not cleared out the peasants, I would not have had the freedom to surround him like that. So my point is that sorceresses ARE force multipliers b/c while they cannot win the game on their own, they do help you do win the combats you need to win (WoP comes to mind).

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Mon Dec 01, 2003 8:02 pm
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MTUCache wrote:
you don't need to worry about your Tank Battallion when you've already carpet bombed the entire enemy force.


Spoken like a zoomie... you're not an aviator, are you?

To paraphrase a famous quote, "You don't hold dung until you've got boots in it."

RBTs cannot take or hold ground. They are not likely to break enemy BCU's on their own. They are a support unit.

Dark Riders can take or hold ground. They are likely to break most enemy BCUs on their own, under optimal circumstances (flank/rear charge) and have a chance of doing it to the front if supported by other 'stuff' (character in the unit, supporting charge by something else, etc).

I think that's the key way to separate Support vs. Force Multiplier. Can the item/thing/unit you're talking about actually take, hold, or contest ground (table quarters)?


Mon Dec 01, 2003 8:07 pm
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Underway,

I think that 5 out of the 5 (with the 2 added later) of your force multipliers can act without BCUs (chariots, hydras, characters, manticore, and dark riders). That isn't enough?

None of them work alone but with several FMs you suddenly have a potent threat. Their often greater mobility only enhances this threat.

I think you can make an army only consisting of FMs, try looking at the 18 chariot thread.

The main reason I bring BCU is to carry mages (they do this well because of their high amount of wounds, and "low" cost), or impose a threat, they don't ever do anything without support from FMs, or by getting flank charges themselves (effectively being a BCU acting as a FM). If they do act by themself without acting as a FM, they are what I previously classified as ECU (Elite Combat Units).

If you have a highborn (stupidity), I would claim that 200pts of chariots on their own are much better than 200pts of spears, so I guees you can say I defenitely don't consider an army of BCUs an option compared to an army of FMs.

Think about it dark riders for rank negation (maybe even a banner) and chariots for kills. This is 2 units of FMs, that are doing what you suggest you need 1 BCU and 1 FM for. Into the equation add that the CoC is more maneuverable (although stupid, and having less wounds, ie more vulnerable), and has a more effective charge range so it will be easier to setup this situation. The combination might even be slightly cheaper aswell.
They both have their uses, but I don't think BCUs are essential at all, on the contrary I think that if you don't have any FMs or SUs, your list will be picked apart.

The problem is that people often label armies of FMs as being "beardy", because it doesn't include the BCUs that are seen as essential for having a "proper" list.


Asger


Mon Dec 01, 2003 8:20 pm
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Maraith Tuerl wrote:
Spoken like a zoomie... you're not an aviator, are you?......
RBTs cannot take or hold ground. They are not likely to break enemy BCU's on their own. They are a support unit.

Dark Riders can take or hold ground. They are likely to break most enemy BCUs on their own, under optimal circumstances (flank/rear charge) and have a chance of doing it to the front if supported by other 'stuff' (character in the unit, supporting charge by something else, etc).

I think that's the key way to separate Support vs. Force Multiplier. Can the item/thing/unit you're talking about actually take, hold, or contest ground (table quarters)?


Nope, never been in the military....

Not to pick on everybody's favorite core unit here (Dark Riders), but I have another flying example of my point.

Okay, so RBTs can't advance and gain tactical ground, relegating them to a support position....understood and agreed.

But, if that's the only thing that seperates them from Dark Riders, then something doesn't hold water. How can Harpies then be relegated to a "support" role, while they perform all of the same functions as the Dark Rider? Have they become so pigeonholed that they are now only useful for killing warmachines and lone mages? I contend that anything that a unit of 5 Dark Riders can do (strafing fire, warmachine hunting, march intervention, flank charging), can be done equally as well by a unit of 8 harpies. Admittedly, they are not as strong of a troop, but that's not what the argument is here.....they are capable of performing the same tasks, but since they are not typically used for all of them, they are now designated as "support"?

Honestly, I am playing the Devil's Advocate here, and my true feelings lean towards designating both the Harpies and Dark Riders support troops, but I thought that I'd make my point in a round-a-bout way. ;)

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Mon Dec 01, 2003 8:40 pm
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This is a good point Maraith. And this is specifically what I asked for clarification on earlier in the thread. The fact of the matter is, pretty much every unit in the game can be considered an FM if you look for a strategy or combination with other units that will allow it to turn the tide of the battle on a local scale. It is the units that are capable of this the majority of the time on their own that are FM's. While combinations like ASH describes above could be considered, I don't know, "Constructed FM's" for lack of a better term, the definition put forth here for an FM would exclude them, since each unit, on its own is really only a support unit. Dyvim Tvar, this is also why the Hydra Banner is a support item.

But I guess the real question I have now, is what does this distinction give us? Okay, now we know how to classify units, either as BCU, SU or FM (acknowledging that there will likely always be some debate on the exact distinctions on occasion). So the next step is to identify how to use this classification system. These are the conclusions that I currently see:
1. A successful list needs to contain aspects of each of these groups.
2. The general needs to be clear, given a list, what role each unit is best at fullfilling in relationship to the remainder of the list.
3. The general needs to develop the skill of identifying the FM's, BCU's and SU's in an opponent's list and concentrate efforts on eliminating one of these three early in the game.
4. ?


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Mon Dec 01, 2003 8:42 pm
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in this case would you class chariots as supporting units or as force multipliers..... i'd guess supporting units, but the whole impact hits thing is a force multiplier on its own?........... kinda..........

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Mon Dec 01, 2003 9:12 pm
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