Advice on starting new army

[LordAK]

I am planning to build a new fantasy army. I'm pretty sure most of us had been through this question many times before.. What army to choose?

What I'm looking at right now are the Beastmen and the Tomb Kings since both armies are the one least played here. I want something fresh and they both have the same unique/rare feel here. The problem is that I know almost nothing about both armies. Their strength, weakness, lore since I have never played against both armies. The easiest way to learn is to buy the Army Book, but I wouldn't want to waste my money on Army Books that I don't use.

I'm not looking to win all games with this new army, just something that can give up good fight on hobby nights. Would be glad to receive help/insights from you guys here.

Thank you.

[Gnosis]

Beastmen are still due for an update for 8th edition, so who knows what they'll do to their rules. But I enjoyed playing them with their 7th edition book under 8th nonetheless. They've got some nice combinations they can pull off, such as a +1S banner for the entire unit which you can stick on a BSB and put in a horde of Gors with additional handweapons for effect. You can take along a few nice monsters or go for big blocks of troops, or both.

Tomb Kings have gotten a rather mediocre armybook under 8th edition; pretty much the only way I've seen them get played is with three characters in a skeleton horde plus some chaff. They'll paint up really quick, though, so that's a bonus.

[T.D.]

My regular Tomb King opponent has abandoned them as his tourney list for the dark side (High Elves).

If you want to game competitively, don't go Tomb Kings.

If you are not interested in competition they have some nice models and gimmicks ...but are slow.

[LordAK]

Beastmen sounds good. But like you mentioned, we don't know what would happen to them after the update. Any news when they'll be updated?

So Tomb Kings is a no go? I don't need a competitive army, but nobody are willing to be punching bag all the time.
I really like the look of Ushabti, Stalkers and Sphinx. How did these 3 units perform on table?

[T.D.]

Both Sphinxes are very good with T8/Fly/HKB or T8/KB/Crush Attack. But if your opponent has easy access to poison they can counter you easily.

Ushabti are uncompetitive with current AB.

Stalkers I haven't faced, possibly due to uncompetitiveness.


Personally, I'd wait until 9th edition -- which is supposed to be coming out this summer -- before deciding on a new army.

[LordAK]

9th is coming?

Thanks for the input. I think I'll get myself a Tomb Kings army book first. Would be a nice collection.

[Saintofm]

9th is coming?

Thanks for the input. I think I'll get myself a Tomb Kings army book first. Would be a nice collection.

That's been in the rumor mill for a while. Games Work shop tends to make a new eddition once every five years and its about that time again. I'm not sure how this will effect us gamers YET.

[LordAK]

I think this is the best edition of all. After the big overhaul of 8th, I don't know what kind of changes they would do for 9th that can be better for the game.

[Gnosis]

I think this is the best edition of all. After the big overhaul of 8th, I don't know what kind of changes they would do for 9th that can be better for the game.

Nerfing steadfast and hordes and toning down magic would be a good start.

[Vulcan]

8th needs some tweaks.

1) Steadfast is just a tad bit strong right now. Yes, a good disciplined unit can hold against a cavalry charge. Skaven Slaves (ld 2) are not exactly disciplined units... and yet a 100-point unit of them will hold anything for a couple turns. A 200 point unit will hold all game.

I can't help but feel a leadership roll should be required for steadfast to reflect the need for discipline to hold the unit together.

2) Monsters don't thunderstop, they TRAMPLE.

3) Miscasts need to go back to double 1s, and miscasts need to override irresistible force. That will bring magic back into balance. The uber spells haven't changed that much; what's changed is that miscasts no longer prevent the spell from going off.

4) The rules need to be tightened up so that there is only one interpretation, and none of this RAW vs RAI bull droppings.

5) Laser guided cannons need to be toned down. Hitting a monster fairly reliably I can understand. Sniping a goblin out in the open with a black powder cannon is... silly.

[direweasel]

Back to the original Q, I would base the choice of a new army on a number of factors:

The minis - this is personal preference, but if you're going to spend hours and hours painting minis, they need to be minis you'll like. I think I'd prefer painting beastmen over tomb kings, but that's me. I'm not buying either one.

The cost - Which army costs more to field 1000 points the way you would field them? 2000? I don't know that answer, I don't know those armies well enough, nor do I know how you'd choose to field them. Obviously, an army of chaos warriors is going to be cheaper money-wise than orcs or skaven. But Beastmen and Tomb Kings are tougher - both have pretty cheap units and pretty expensive units. Depends on how you plan on doing it.

What's already in your group/store/setting - you don't want to be the 6th guy with one type of army, while nobody is playing the other. You've already taken that into account by choosing Beastmen and Tomb Kings to start with, but it's worth mentioning on general principle.

Which fits your play style more? Which would do better against the usual opponents you find yourself most likely to face?

Answer those questions, you'll find your army.

[MangoPunch]

8th needs some tweaks.

3) Miscasts need to go back to double 1s, and miscasts need to override irresistible force. That will bring magic back into balance. The uber spells haven't changed that much; what's changed is that miscasts no longer prevent the spell from going off.

... So much for Ring of Hotek.

[Vulcan]

The ring worked great in 7th edition; so much so it made a 'no magic' list quite possible for DE. We'd just have to be errated back to that version.

Which I admit is a forlorn hope, given the speed with which GW HASN'T been putting out errata lately...

[Askador]

My First army was Tomb kings. Its a cool army and you can win games with them.
But if you meet an serious Opponent they are just toast.

They have no armor, cant march, they are slow and expensive.
It can be frustrating if that is your only army.

I got the best results with an Chariot Bus of 9 with a King inside wearing the Mask. With some Magic support they can drive through an whole army. But as soon you meet an WoC List with 4 Flying Charakters you should not even start to play.
Even a Peg Dreadlord can kill the half of your Army alone.

[Vulcan]

As one of the better players in our local meta, I was recently waxed by an experienced Tomb Kings player. Yes, TK are one of the weaker armies. But if you buckle down and really learn how to use them to their best they CAN win games.

Not easily, no. But it can be done.

[Askador]

As one of the better players in our local meta, I was recently waxed by an experienced Tomb Kings player. Yes, TK are one of the weaker armies. But if you buckle down and really learn how to use them to their best they CAN win games.

Not easily, no. But it can be done.

Like i sayd it depends on your enemy. You cant throw enaugh Purple suns to get rid of an full Riding/Flying WoC army
Just impossible to stop them in 2 turns. if they get into melee there is nothing you can do. If you playing against a nice and frendly list with Chaos Warriors and Chosen ones and stuff like that its possible to win.

As the the Beastman. I like the idea of an Mass model Melee army. The problem is .. they are just not good in melee. Even if they have some really cool rules and Charakters. They really need a new book.

The sad part is.. Tomb Kings already have a "new" book.. they will be like that for some time now.

[Omnichron]

TK armies can win tournaments if the list and player is good.

How would you take on a list of several sphinxes, a hierophant, casket, death snipers, archers and mounted archers? It can be really painful and difficult to take on such a list.

I do agree though, if you start with TK, you will be at a disadvantage compared to some other armies when it comes to what choices will work and which won't. Personally I wouldn't go for TK as you really lack mobility... I think it's kind of a boring army in those regards.

Beastmen is quite cool, but I'd wait for an update before I'd pick them.