What I have been playing with lately, Khainite list at 2250

[Druchii77]

Having read quite a few lists lately, I figured I would show the list I have been playing with lately. I decided awhile back that I really wanted to make a Khainite list work. Early on, there were quite a few lists that sought to make a totally Khainite list viable. These usually included Hellbron to make our witch elves core units. Their one problem continued to be that if you play with a totally Khainite you couldn't take much in the way of magic defense.
However, I decided, that a strong Khainite theme could be maintained while still being a strong build that stood a chance in competitive settings. Thus, my Khainite army was born.

Master- general, heavy armor, shield, sea dragon cloak, pendant of khaeleth, sword of might, riding a dark steed
Death Hag- cauldron of blood
Death Hag- BSB, standard of hag graef, rune of khaine, manbane
Sorceress- lvl. 1, 2 scrolls
Assassin- extra hand weapon, rune of khaine, touch of death

10 crossbows-shields, muso
10 crossbows-shields, muso
5 dark riders- crossbows, muso
5 harpies
5 harpies

20 witch elves- full command, banner of murder
18 executioners- full command
16 black guard- full command, ring of hotek

Hydra

The general idea was maintain the Khainite theme while also keeping some of the elements that were rock hard. In the end, I have a solid battle line with three stubborn infantry blocks. Each unit has loads of killing power. I also have enough shooting and movement to eliminate long range threats quickly. Finally, my magic defense is strong enough to keep me whole while getting me into my opponents.

Combat ability:
My three elite infantry units can deal large numbers of attacks and in all cases negate armor save to some extent. Combined with the cauldron blessings, any of these units can mow through enemy unit with ease. The Hydra is my flanker/ arrow magnet. This allows me to get my infantry into combat whole and sound. He also doesn't shirk from charging knight units with killing blow from the cauldron and eating characters and knights easily.

Shooting:
I can deal out 50 crossbow shots which are all armor piercing. My hydra can also eat through soft and medium units with impunity. Recently, my hydra burned through 11 tomb king skeletons in one blast of its fiery breath.

Speed:
While my infantry slogs across the board, my dark riders and harpies go forward to hamper shooting and magic. Each unit is capable of destroying war machines, mages, or even small archer units. They are also cheap enough to be expendable.

Magic:
My magic defense is easily enough to handle most normal magic. The things it does struggle against are tomb king incantations (the ring doesn't prevent these) and one dice casting. 3 dice and two scrolls combined with the ring will stay my opponents magic long enough to eliminate its casters or to get into combat. It also has allowed me to learn how to prioritize my magic defense. Now, magic missiles are usually let through hoping that the ring will take care of them or that I won't take too many casualties.

Theme:
All things khainite are included in the list. I have a cauldron, a Hag BSB, executioners, witch elves, an assassin, and harpies. Though I have included black guard, dark riders, crossbows, etc., the list still maintains a strong khainite theme. It is also viable as an army.

I will admit that I included almost all of the nasty items in this list, but they create such a synergy with the army, that it is hard to resist taking them. Thus, the Standard of Hag Graef, RIng of Hotek, and Pendant of Khaeleth are all included for their parts.

So far, I have experienced battles with wood elves, vampires, tomb kings, warriors of chaos, high elves, and dwarves. The only army that has greatly troubled me is an evasive, shooty Wood Elf list. If this army sees combat, it usually wins. It is power sitting on an unsually thin line, but if played well, it wins big.

Feel free to give any comments or criticism. I simply wanted to share my list with the forum.

[Druchiishootlord]

I like the list. The thing that I have a question on though is the Cauldron. How often do you see combat with it? I mean I have been thinking of dropping the manbane and rune from my Cauldron Hag in my own list.

Just as well I have also been looking at dropping the Dreadlord for a Master to pick up more points and add some other infantry into the list. How does your Master perform? Is the lack of LD 10 hurtful for the list at all?

[Dyvim tvar]

List looks pretty solid -- only 2 comments:

I would probably try to squeeze in another unit of Dark Riders by running the elite infantry in slightly smaller units (particularly the witches and executioners).

I would take Manbane instead of Touch of Death on the Assassin, but that's not a really big deal in my mind.

[Druchii77]

@Shootlord. My Cauldron hag doesn't have any khainite gifts. That is my BSB. She does well with those. She usually gives the executioners ASF and then hacks down tough monsters with their help.

@Dyvim. Touch of Death has been great on my assassin. I don't know how many things I have killing blowed, but he is remarkable. Among his kills are Grimgor Ironhide and many Vampires. I too would like another unit of dark riders, but I went without to build a stronger Khainite theme with the harpies.

[Druchiishootlord]

I framed my question wrong. I meant to ask if you think it necessary for a Cauldron Hag to have any gifts? That way I can appropriately remove or keep them on my own.

[Dyvim tvar]

@Dyvim. Touch of Death has been great on my assassin. I don't know how many things I have killing blowed, but he is remarkable. Among his kills are Grimgor Ironhide and many Vampires.

I agree that Killing Blow is a great thing for an assassin. Only reason I question it all all in this army is you have the Cauldron and so can give Killing Blow to him during the game. But that can be hard to do and you may have other priorities, so I understand the choice you made.

[Druchii77]

@shootlord. I never give my cauldron hag gifts. She is usually behind my lines. I don't give her gifts because the only things that charge her usually are light units looking for an easy kill, which she isn't, or big units hoping to get behind my lines. Either way, by time my opponent gets to my cauldron, it is either too late for me to win or too late for him to.

[Mekhet]

The only thing I see is that it would be a nice idea to either drop some gift of the CoB, 2 exec, 2 WE or one of both unit to get black lotus on your assassin to lose poisoned attack and to gain reroll failed to wound rolls (you get by mathammer at least 1 KB in the 1st round, thanks to him I KBed many things)

[Irtehdar]

I like your list. With very few variations its pretty close to the BoD lists Ive toyed around with alot during the fall and yes this list is very capable against most lists. Only thing Im wondering is where does your Master on DS fit into this army? I would if using thast list probably stuffed him into the BG unit and put the Sorc on the steed for increased protection(read: ability to run around units at a faster rate to avoid pesky flying magehunters)

[Druchii77]

My master goes into the 16 black guard to bring them up to 18 in 6x3 formation. I have him on the steed for additional armor save, but also for the ability to charge out and handle light units should the opportunity arise. For instance, against some wood elves, late in the game, he charged out of the unit to hit a glade guard unit and destroyed them.

I don't care much for the sorceress' safety as she is there to throw down her two scrolls in the initial phases of the game and to add her additional dispel die. Usually she sit in a crossbow unit.

[Master of arneim]

I used to play a similar list a while ago and it is really similar to yours, you can find it there:
http://www.druchii.net/viewtopic.php?t=58609

There is also a report from a tourney.

I'd like to ask what do you think about ethereals: I'm scared to death by them and for this I kept my dreadlord with hydra blade. Do you think you can handle them with this list?

How does this list work without Rbts?

[Druchii77]

Ethereals are one of my fears too oddly enough. I guess it all depends on the nature of the ethereal unit. If I am up against spirit hosts, I usually assign harpies and a unit of crossbows to intercept and keep them busy.

If I am up against wraiths, I task my master and black guard with dealing with them as he has the only magic weapon. It is my hope that his attacks plus my little bit of static res will whittle them down slowly.

I do all of this while my little level 1 hopes for my opponent to roll double 1s to dispel or I get an IF to fireball them, which oddly enough happens more often than you would think. I always throw three dice at it.

In regards to the lack of RBT, I like it, though I started out feeling a bit out of place. I always used to use RBT. I found out, that usually my opponent's fast stuff/flyers would take them out by the end of the game. Now, with my firepower mobile, most of my opponents, have nothing to dowith those mobile units. I can shoot them down just as easily with 50 s3 armor piercing shots, and I can enter combat with these units. I don't have to feel like I need to babysit them either. Overall, it is a good feeling.

[Master of arneim]

How do you control the big targets as bloodthirster and star dragon? I don't think that your shooting is enough and without the Rbts you could risk a lot, not to tell about the steam tank. Every one of these units should be a serious threat to your list, isn't it?

[Druchii77]

With larger stubborn khainite units, I stand a good chance of holding a dragonlord or bloodthirster up for a turn or two. I do admit however, that these very builds may be my achilles' heel.