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The D.R.A.I.C.H. Boot Camp – Shooting 
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The D.R.A.I.C.H. Boot Camp – evaluating DE units.

Boot Camp 0 – Admission
Boot Camp 1 – First Week – resistance to mass shooting
Boot Camp 2 – Second Week – Resistance to a charge
Boot Camp 3 – Third Week – charging destructive power
Boot Camp 4 – Forth Week – killing when exhausted: further rounds of melee
Boot Camp 5 – Fifth Week – doping with a cauldron of blood
Boot Camp 6 – Sixth Week – flag-doping
Boot Camp 7 – Seventh Week – The Monoliths Shooting Range
Boot Camp 8 – Eighth Week – graduation ceremony – unit’s champions.
Boot Camp 9 – Last Week – specialization – departure for War.

Boot Camp extension
Boot Camp 1bis – First Week-end – template vulnerability (considered)

Other DE training rooms (might be considered some day – not necessarily by the same author):
Temple of Khaine’s fencing room
Clar Karond Noblemen’s Arena
Iron Mountains’ Ranch
Ghrond Experimental Lab

For a quick conclusion, jump to the last chapter.

Last edited by Calisson on Sun Mar 08, 2009 1:30 pm, edited 3 times in total.

Sun Feb 15, 2009 10:27 pm
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1. Seventh Week – The Monoliths Shooting Range.

Which units are evaluated?
This week, the units are evaluated only for the sake of shooting.
Only the units able to shot and happy just to shoot are evaluated: RHB corsairs, MXB, DR with MXB, shades (naked) and RBT.

What is the evaluation?
The test is simple: each unit shoots at the same sampled opposing units as usual (Marauders, Ogre, Dwarves, Knights, COC and Dragon). We look at the average result.

Multiple shots for crossbows are always preferred to single shots. The only occurrence when single shots would be more interesting is if you needed 9 “to hit” with single shot, and 10 with multiple shots.

There are penalties for shooting: distance, moving, hidden target...
RHB corsairs are likely to move before shooting, but they shoot at targets with no distance modifications.
MXB are likely to stay where they are and shoot at long distance. Same for RBT (assuming they are in the rear, possibly on a hill).
DR with MXB are very likely to move and shoot at short distance. Same for shades.
Overall, I will assume that the targeting modification is -1 for all of them (in addition to the -1 for multiple shooting, for everyone except RBT).

Efficiency is quite easy to determine: Some units benefit from a better shooting ability. Otherwise, the more you shoot, the more likely you kill. Very obvious, no need to write a thread on that.

Instead of evaluating the raw kills stats, we will try to determine if the shots are cost-efficient.
One idea to take into account is that killing a Knight is worth more than killing a Marauder.
How much more? Let's just take the cost of a Marauder (9pts) and the cost of a Knight (21 pts), and multiply that cost by the probability of killing them.
Instead of kills stats, we get killed points stats.
When computing the results, it shows that there is no big difference between foes: the most difficult to kill (or those who have many wounds) cost more, and the raise in cost balances well the raise in resistance.

This is not enough to tell which units are cost-efficient or not:
If unit “A” costs 100 pts and kills 2 knights per turn, and unit “B” costs 300 pts and kills 4 knights per turn, obviously “B” is more efficient but “A” is more cost-efficient.
In order to compare units to each other, we will divide the cost of the killed units by the cost of the shooting unit.

In the end, we will get how many pts of target will kill one pt of each unit.

Survival expectancy and shooting range.
I wish also to take into account that some units are not likely to be in range for shooting:
The corsairs with their RHB are quite helpless. They may shoot once, then they are likely to be charged (and shoot a second time, with the stand & shoot reaction).
For that reason, I have to consider that corsairs will shoot only 2 times in a game (rough estimation).

As a comparison, the long range units are made to shoot 6 times in a game. Of course, chances are that they would be charged before the end. But at least, they will not try deliberately to get into melee.

Shades are supposed to start the game in a wood, let the main opponent's troops come forward, then they get out of the wood and shoot at their flanks. I don't take GW shades here, so they don't want to charge, and may be lucky enough to shoot 4 times during the full battle.

DR with MXB are meant to shoot, and occasionally charge a war machine. Unfortunately, mine have the nasty habit of dying before the end of the battle. Let's consider that they shoot from turn 1 to destruction in turn 5. Four rounds of shooting.

MXB are supposed to stay in the rear. They are never considered as the most threatening unit, so they are not unlikely to remain till the end. Let's give them 5 rounds of shooting, it is probably still on the optimistic side.

RBT are also supposed to stay in the rear. They are often the target of cannons or flyers, sot their life expectancy is not very good. A reasonable assumption is that they were able to shoot 4 times before dying.

Overall everyone has 4 rounds of shooting except corsairs (2) and MXB (5). That is my arbitrary, but it could change based on the comments, of course!

Combination of all factors.
All the factors above are combined together for the comparison in this thread.
The units shoot at each sample unit, and get -1 penalty for shooting. The number of kills is multiplied by the value of the target, and divided by the value of the shooter.
Then, the result is multiplied by the number of shots expected during a battle, as explained just above.
This is what I call the cost-efficiency of each unit.

Last edited by Calisson on Tue Aug 04, 2009 8:12 pm, edited 2 times in total.

Sun Feb 15, 2009 10:28 pm
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2. The results.

The best shooting unit is the MXB.
Shades and RBT are significantly behind: they are accurate or hard hitting, but expensive.
Corsairs and DR are less efficient. Corsairs can’t shoot often and DR are just too expensive.

A true druchii gunline is made of mostly MXB for core, all rare slots as RBT and, not necessarily, some special slots as shades.

Let’s have a closer look to each unit.

Multi Cross-bow warriors.
MXB are the best shooters.
They are cheap enough and their crossbows are deadly enough to kill worth their cost in average in five turns or less. If they survive till the end, the extra shooting is a bonus, and the best is if they can occupy a ¼ table at the end of the battle.

Their champion is slightly more accurate. However, it is more expansive. The raise in efficiency balances exactly the raise in the price in the conditions considered (-2 to shoot). When the shooting is easier (at close distance or at a large target) then the champion is less interesting. When the shooting is harder (skirmishers at long distance or while moving) then the champion is more interesting. Overall he is not much useful from a shooting perspective.
The champion must never be taken unless there is another use for him (such as protecting the sorceress seeking shelter in that unit). Otherwise, it is usually more interesting to have one more shooter, who can take one more wound.

Reaper Bolt Thrower.
The RBT is cost-effective, as long as it can shoot 6 times.
It must be used as a six-shooter in any situation, except against the dragon, for which the single bolt will provide better results.
If it shoots at pretty much anything during 4 turns at close distance, or during 5 turns at long distance, it pays back its cost (in average), i.e. it will have killed around 100pts of foe. If it survives any longer, that’s a bonus.
The RBT is able to wound the hardest targets, much more than a rain of bolts of equivalent cost. It is not that much effective, at long distance in average, it needs 6 single shots to kill a dragon. For that reason, it is a good idea to take a group of 4 RBT.
Its weakness is its survival rate: it makes so good a target that it will be canon-sniped or hero-charged by turn 2 more often than not.
Actually, the RBT may be more effective than what my computations show, because of its very long range and its 360° LOS:
- it will hardly ever run short of target;
- very often, its shooting modification will be 0 rather than -1.
However, I assumed it would survive 4 turns, which is far from granted…

Shades need to shoot around 5 times at an average target to pay back their cost. They are slightly less cost-effective than MXB. The difficulty is really to get these five shots, and not to be shot or charged while trying to do it.
For that reason, I would not advise to take many shades in a shooty army. One unit may well find a nice forest to start the game in, and may find convenient targets throughout the game. For several units, it becomes really not obvious.
Their champion is more accurate, but much more expensive. When all factors are taken into account, the champion is really not cost-effective. The only reason to take a champion would be to go in melee with him.

Multi Cross-bow Dark Riders.
DR are not cost-efficient if only their shooting skill is taken into account. They would need 10 rounds of shooting to pay back their cost, which is impossible. They must find another role to justify their cost, such as mage/war machine hunters, march-blockers, ¼ table… in addition to shooting.
The champion is slightly less cost-effective. Taking a champion instead of two regular DR means being able to receive one less wound, for no significant advantage. The only reason to take a champion could be for melee purpose, but not for missile purpose.

Repeater Hand Bow Corsairs.
Like everyone, I consider Corsairs to be the least efficient shooters, due to the limited range. This is due to the (realistic) hypothesis that they would get only 2 shots in a full battle, when they would need to shoot 6 times to pay back their cost.
They must not be considered as pure shooters. They can be considered having a dual role, such as shooting and providing a cover.
Actually, their “bow” should be compared to a hurled weapon, such as an axe. With that in mind, they have an impressive “hurled weapon” capability, and must be used in the corresponding way.
With that “hurled weapon” image, some new tactics spring in mind, such as a harassing, cheap unit. This unit will shoot only twice but can be sacrificed in order to get a convenient setting for a future charge.
The champion is slightly less cost-effective. There is no good reason to take one champion in a RHB corsair unit.

Last edited by Calisson on Sun Feb 15, 2009 10:33 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Sun Feb 15, 2009 10:28 pm
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3. Characters shooting.

“Milord! Madam! What a great honour! You are going to teach all of us a lesson! Please, take place on the range.”

In case someone wants to try a shooty army, the question rises about how effective it is to take a Master with the sole purpose of shooting. In that case, the full cost of the Master is included in the evaluation. I will consider the master on a steed and allow him to shoot 6 times with an MXB or 5 times with a pair of RHB.

Second question, quite different, in case the Master is taken for melee, is it worth buying a range weapon just for a couple of turns when he will be out of melee? In that case, only the additional cost of the weapon is taken into account, the Master is supposed to pay back his cost in melee. The shooting will be scarce, of course, most of the battle is supposed to happen in melee. I will allow the Master to shoot 3 times with an MXB and twice with a pair of RHB.

When taking a sorceress, is the Lifetaker worth its cost? In that case, only the additional cost of the weapon is taken into account, because the Sorceress is supposed to pay back her cost by casting spells. The shooting may happen every turn of the battle, as the sorceress is not supposed to be in melee and will always be in range of the Lifetaker.

As a result, it is never cost-effective to take a Master for the sole purpose of shooting.Even with a pair of RHB, the Master cannot possibly pay back his cost.

On the other hand, the MXB is always good to provide to any Master designed for melee: it will kill in 3 shots more than its modest cost, and the Master is rather likely to be out of melee three turns. A pair of RHB are more effective but no more cost-effective, they need 3 rounds of shooting as well to pay back their cost.
It means that if the intention is to have the Master on foot or on a chariot, the MXB is a must.
If the intention is to move very quickly towards the enemy and remain close to him (such as a Master mounting a Manticore or a Pegasus), then buying a pair of RHB is a good idea.

The Lifetaker is exceptional.
In 3 rounds of shooting at anything, it will kill more than its cost.
A sorceress does nothing during the missile phase; she does not want to get in melee; a missile weapon is always nice to have and she can get only that one.
The range is better than most spells; it does not take into account the shooting ability of the sorceress.
The Lifetaker is a mandatory complement for one sorceress who would not have filled up her magic pts allowance.

When considering a shooty/magic army, the Lifetaker is a must.

Last edited by Calisson on Sun Feb 15, 2009 10:34 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Sun Feb 15, 2009 10:29 pm
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4. End of the sixth week.

To be ended in another, last, thread.
But before that ultimate one, I wish to examine the champions.
(see hyperlinks in the beginning of the thread).

What is left to do is to summarize the quality of the diverse troops available, and to determine for which use they are eligible, in which settings.

If you find that some of the conclusions drawn here are inconsistent with your own feeling, it could be worth investigating. I could further analyse the reasons for the divergence – or identify the flaw in my reasoning, and correct it for the sake of all D.netters.

I am eager to learn about actual successful / unsuccessful live experience in application of this lengthy theory-hammering.

Winds never stop blowing, Oceans are borderless. Get a ship and a crew, so the World will be ours! Today the World, tomorrow Nagg! {--|oBrotherhood of the Coast!o|--}

Last edited by Calisson on Sun Feb 15, 2009 10:38 pm, edited 3 times in total.

Sun Feb 15, 2009 10:29 pm
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5. Stats Records.

Expected shots during a battle (author’s estimation):
2 for RHB corsair & champion
5 for MXB & champion
4 for DR with MXB & champion
4 for Shade & champion
4 for RBT
6 for Sorceress with Lifetaker
6 for missile Nobleman with MXB
5 for missile Nobleman with 2 RHB
3 for melee Nobleman with MXB
2 for melee Nobleman with 2 RHB

Targets killed during the battle (expressed in pts) per 1 pt value of shooter: Average pts killed per pt
Pts killed of Marauders – Ogres – Dwarves – Knights – DE COC – Dragon

RHB corsair : 0.3
0,6 0,6 0,2 0,1 0,2 0,3
RHB corsair champion : 0.3
0,5 0,5 0,2 0,1 0,2 0,3
MXB: 1.1
1,5 1,5 1,2 0,5 0,7 1,1
MXB champion: 1.1
1,5 1,5 1,2 0,5 0,7 1,0
DR with MXB: 0.4
0,5 0,6 0,4 0,2 0,3 0,4
DR with MXB champion: 0.4
0,5 0,5 0,4 0,2 0,2 0,3
Shade: 0.8
1,1 1,1 0,9 0,4 0,5 0,7
Shade champion: 0.5
0,7 0,7 0,5 0,2 0,3 0,4
RBT, 6 S4: 0.7
0,7 0,8 0,8 0,4 0,7 0,9
RBT, 1 S6: 0.5
0,2 0,5 0,4 0,2 0,7 1,4
Sorceress with Lifetaker: 2.4 (the best!, it means that the Lifetaker kills 2.4 times its cost in a battle)
3,0 3,4 2,3 1,1 2,1 2,2
missile Nobleman with MXB: 0.2
0,3 0,3 0,3 0,1 0,1 0,2
missile Nobleman with 2 RHB: 0.3
0,5 0,5 0,2 0,1 0,2 0,2
melee Nobleman with MXB: 1.3 (if shooting 3 times)
1,8 1,8 1,4 0,6 0,8 1,1
melee Nobleman with 2 RHB: 0.8 (if shooting only twice)
1,5 1,5 0,6 0,3 0,5 0,6

Winds never stop blowing, Oceans are borderless. Get a ship and a crew, so the World will be ours! Today the World, tomorrow Nagg! {--|oBrotherhood of the Coast!o|--}

Sun Feb 15, 2009 10:29 pm
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