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2500 pts vs Warriors of Chaos 
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Executioner
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Joined: Fri Oct 03, 2008 6:46 am
Posts: 182
Location: Sunny Brisbane
My List:
Dreadlord with Potion of Strength, Sword of Ruin, Null Talisman on COK
Lvl 4 with Dagger, Seal of Ghrond, Pendant - Dark Magic
Master BSB with Hydra Banner on COK
Lvl 2 with Scroll - Lore of Metal
Death Hag with Cauldron and Manbane

2 x 5 Harpies
2 x 5 Dark Riders with RXBs
1 x 19 Spears
1 x 24 Spears

9 x COK with Banner of Murder and Null Talisman
1 x Chariot

1 x Hydra

This battle was about testing the COK hammer. Basically the idea is to put the BSB and General in there and use the Cauldron to give it ward saves until the round it charges and then give it an extra attack. With the Hydra Banner that makes the unit very dangerous and can deal with any RNF unit of up to 30 models (doing enough wounds to remove steadfast) or completely wipe out any +1 AS unit of 10 - 12 models. The null talismans give it a 3+ ward vs magic when combined with the Cauldron blessing so it should be able to survive reasonably well and the Lord is designed to take out characters who might have thought they would be striking before my COKs.

The Warrior Army looked a bit like this

1 x Lvl 4 with the WOC Lore
1 x BSB
1 x 30 Warriors of Tzeench
1 x 30 Warriors of Khorne
1 x 7 Knights of Khorne
1 x 6 Knights of Tzeentch
1 x 40 Marauders
1 x Hell Cannon
4 x 5 Dogs

The opening 2 turns were about me dealing with the dogs which were seriously getting in the way and setting up for a COK charge. I got some luck and cast Final Transmutation on the Tzeentch block and killed 5. The harpies, after breaking a unit of dogs overran into the flank of the 7 Khorne knights - I slipped a wound through and he did 1 back which had me up by 1 with a flank charge, he broke and ran through another unit of mine which killed another knight.

Dark riders charged the Hell Cannon which held it up for a turn but they were all killed in the end. The Hydra took a charge from the 6 Knights to protect my COK's flank and held. The Hydra broke the knights after 4 rounds of combat suffering only 2 wounds.

The main action was in the centre where I finally got a chance to charge but failed to make the distance and next round the Tzeentch warriors charged me. I did 8 wounds to 3 which broke his steadfast and he failed his leadership roll - that killed the BSB and unit standard bearer. I held, reformed and charged the Khorne warriors next round. The Khorne warriors ranks had been thinned a little from a Soul Stealer and Pit of Shades, so my knights killed every single one of the rest of the unit before he could strike, which somewhat surprised my opponent.

The over-run, however left the COKs exposed to the Lvl 4 in the Maurauder block and he rolled 5/5 for winds of magic. That meant my unit took a Flickering Fire, Gateway and Treason which, even with 2 Null Talismans, left only the BSB and Lord left. By that time the game was over however and my Lvl 2 got Final Transformation off next round on the Maurauders and killed 13, panicking the unit which kept running off the board.

Final result was a 20-0 with no Warriors left on the board

A note on Magic - I put my Lvl 4 with the 24 Spearmen and take Dark Magic. I have found that the damage output is brutal. No more than 2 dice are required for any of our spells with the dagger as insurance for a poor roll. She rarely miscasts and dropped several black horrors which did bad things to S4 knighs (and killed the Hell Cannon :o) I think people get caught up in the shiny new lores but Dark Magic makes the magic phase very reliable and low risk. Having said that I always take a Lvl 2 with Lore of Metal because Searing Doom scares the shizz out of knights and always draws a scroll or plenty of dispell dice.

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Last edited by Grimma on Mon Oct 04, 2010 11:43 pm, edited 1 time in total.



Thu Aug 19, 2010 11:50 pm
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Slave on the Altar

Joined: Fri Oct 01, 2010 2:53 pm
Posts: 2
Location: SF Bay Area, Ca.
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Great post Grimma, thank you! I only have ten WHFB games under my belt (all 8th) but I play with a big mob of Fantasy/40K vets, and any/all intel on armies I have not faced is greatly appreciated. Your advice on Dark M. Lore fits my own experience, as someone drawn to the shiny new Lores. My Magic Phases have been very hit or miss. While Purple Sun and particularly Mindrazor have inflicted opponent-unmanning carnage, I have also had many Phases in which I achieved nothing at all. I plan on returning to a 4th lvl Shadow + 2nd lvl Dark w/ ToF. I also find your experience with CoK very familiar. I have focused on this unit type from game one, running from 8 to 16 to 2 units of 6-8, always with Malus n Spite in one. I have noticed that Malus is not that popular, but his Demon bonuses, plus Wharpsword have just ripped through my enemies. Im still learning to place them properly and they are a huge point sink, but the Empire, Ogres, Wood Elves, and especially Beets are all still shaking their heads and whining about the damage done by my CoKs lol! I have thus far used the BoHG (ASF), Mindrazor, and CoB+ 1A, to do things like charge 3 large Bret Knight blocks all lined up and simply rip them open with 16 CoK in 2X8. Anyway, thanks again!


Mon Oct 04, 2010 4:58 pm
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Rending Star
Rending Star
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Joined: Tue Jun 11, 2002 6:10 am
Posts: 5030
Location: Germany
Grimma wrote:
The null talismans give it a 3+ ward vs magic when combined with the Cauldron blessing


That's wrong, unfortunately. Only Null Talismans worn by the same character stack.

I have also played a list with a big COK unit once (even bigger, 20 models strong, but it was a 2999 pts game) with a Dreadlord in the unit. I gave him the Crown of Command, though, in order to minimize the chances to actually lose combat and flee on a bad round (or to act independantly of the unit).

The COK champion got the Spellshield (instead of Null Talisman) in order to also be able to take the Luckstone (which is really nice with the 2+ armour save).

Quote:
The harpies, after breaking a unit of dogs overran into the flank of the 7 Khorne knights - I slipped a wound through and he did 1 back which had me up by 1 with a flank charge, he broke and ran through another unit of mine which killed another knight.


LOL! Talk about some bad luck for those knights, getting broken by a bunch of Harpies is pretty ridiculous. :lol:

I think you mixed up "knights" and "warriors" a few times. ;)

Err... and how exactly do you kill a Hellcannon with Black Horror? It only deals one Wound. :)

Bye
Thanee


Mon Oct 04, 2010 7:29 pm
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Malekith's Best Friend
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Joined: Fri Sep 22, 2006 1:04 am
Posts: 1255
Location: Calgary, Alberta
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Great Post Grimma. Very insightful. I am looking at a large unit of CoK myself, so this read has been pretty encouraging.

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Mon Oct 04, 2010 7:58 pm
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Executioner
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Joined: Fri Oct 03, 2008 6:46 am
Posts: 182
Location: Sunny Brisbane
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@Thanee - thanks for highlighting a couple of things in the list that I had arse about. Sadly null talismans do not stack - how good would that be! The Hell Cannon only had 1 would left when it failed its Strength test.

As a side note I took this list to a 6 game tournament (after fixing the Null Talisman mistake :D) and the COK unit attracted A LOT of unwanted attention from war machines of all descriptions AND I failed every charge I declared with them. So I've changed to a Lvl 4 + Lvl 2 both with Shadow and a unit of 18 Corsairs with a smaller unit of COK without the Hydra banner. I idea being that there are more units that can deliver a punch.

With the backing of Shadow magic the Corsairs have been the stars of every game I've run them in so we'll see how they go in a tournament setting.

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Mon Oct 04, 2010 11:11 pm
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Malekith's Best Friend
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Joined: Thu Aug 31, 2006 2:54 am
Posts: 1444
Location: Santa Barbara, CA
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You seem to have a lot of points invested in characters. Did you change your character setup with your new list, at all? I find that infantry regiments are just so robust and versatile in 8th, that fielding plenty of them plus some decent support units really doesn't let me take a lot of characters.

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Mon Oct 04, 2010 11:23 pm
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Executioner
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Joined: Fri Oct 03, 2008 6:46 am
Posts: 182
Location: Sunny Brisbane
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That was the problem - to get the COK unit to work properly you have to put a lot of points into it with banners and characters. And when a Warp lightning cannon takes 3 or 4 models off per shot your bottom lip starts quivering.

I'm playing a 2000pt 6 game tourny in 2 weeks and will have a Lvl 4, Lvl 2 (both with Shadow), COB, 2 x 5 harpies, 19 Spears, 14 RXBs, 18 Corsairs, 8 COK, Chariot, Hydra. While I love what you can do with Dark Magic under 8th, I need all the spells in the Shadow deck to make it work properly. The Withering in particular is the reason I took the RXBs - their damage output is doubled or tripled with that spell against certain units.

At 2200pts I would add the Master/Pegasus combo and use Steed of Shadows to catapult him across the table.

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UNSEEN LERKER MAGAZINE - It'll make you happier than a Corsair in a Bretonnian orphanage.


Mon Oct 04, 2010 11:40 pm
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