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How to fight against Goblin Fanatics 
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Slave (off the Altar)

Joined: Thu Sep 02, 2010 5:04 pm
Posts: 19
I played against a greenskin army last week. I won easily, because a lot of them were goblins and they have fear of elves. But I had a terrible problem: the fanatics. Every goblin unit had a couple of those crazy things, and they destroyed my witch elves and some CoK.

What is the best way to fight against them? Now I think to make run the goblins shooting a lot is a good idea, but they always have the general nearby and it's difficult to make them run.

Good morning!


Sat Sep 04, 2010 9:44 am
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Executioner
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Cheap sacrificial units of Dark Riders. Use their Vanguard move to get as close as you can to the NG units, directly between them and your army. They either waste a turn shooting the DR away - which gives you an extra turn of shooting at them - or risk releasing their fanatics right in front of their own lines.

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Sat Sep 04, 2010 10:23 am
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Malekith's Best Friend
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A few units of Harpies can be useful to draw them out. Low cost and high movement means you can draw most of the fanatics out in the first few turns and deal with them before they get to the units they can pull apart like CoKs.

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Sat Sep 04, 2010 10:29 am
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Rending Star
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Yep, that's pretty much it. Use some cheap, fast unit to trigger them before they come too close to your own army. Once released they move in a random direction on subsequent turns, so if they are closer to your opponent, chances are good, that they might attack his units. Of course, in such a case, he will just have them run into some terrain piece (which destroys them) while releasing them (he can release them in ANY direction, regardless of what unit triggered them), but that is also good for you.

Bye
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Sat Sep 04, 2010 10:38 am
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Slave on the Altar

Joined: Thu Sep 02, 2010 4:08 pm
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Since you can now measure the distances at any given time, you can fly a unit of harpies directly to the point between two units of night goblins where the distance betwen the harpies and both units are exactly 8 inches. So you only sacrifice (it may survive, but...) one unit of harpies to trigger two teams of fanatics. :)

If he has no fanatics the harpies can still hunt some warmachines or beat up some wolfriders, so they are never useless against O&G.


Sat Sep 04, 2010 10:55 am
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Slave (off the Altar)

Joined: Thu Sep 02, 2010 5:04 pm
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Thanks for the comments!

Now I got a unit of 5 Shades and another of 5 Harpies on the list, so I'll try the tactics. What unit of those two would better do the "kamikaze" role?


Sat Sep 04, 2010 4:03 pm
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Rending Star
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Harpies are usually perfect for this.

Bye
Thanee


Sat Sep 04, 2010 4:59 pm
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Warrior

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Harpies would be better as mentioned. Once they are released..Shoot them.


Sat Sep 04, 2010 5:38 pm
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Malekith's Best Friend
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Indeed, use sacrificial units to draw them out, sit back for a turn, and eventually shoot them down to cause panic tests (the US 5 needed to cause panic is gone :P)

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Sun Sep 05, 2010 7:13 am
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XXLoesche wrote:
Since you can now measure the distances at any given time, you can fly a unit of harpies directly to the point between two units of night goblins where the distance betwen the harpies and both units are exactly 8 inches. So you only sacrifice (it may survive, but...) one unit of harpies to trigger two teams of fanatics. :).
Legal, but I've find that tactics so unsportman that we decided that there is always one unit closest by a zillionth's of ".
Honestly, gobbos are struggling against DE, we don't need to push our advantage that far!

As said, harpies are the best unit to be sacrificed: very cheap, very easy to place where we want, it will never trigger panic into anybody else.
Alrternatively, DR (much more expensive) or Shades (same).

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Sun Sep 05, 2010 8:32 am
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I am not so keen on using Harpies, the Gobbo fanatic will easily kill them and then continue to smash into your lines. Harpies are cheap but Fanatics are 1/2 the price of Harpies plus they don't give up any points themselves so this is a real lose/lose situation.

The best way to trigger them is if another OnG unit is between your unit and theirs so they have to smash through their own guys first. Another good option is to make use of terrain. A unit of Shades for instance in a forest can release the fanatics who can't enter the forest.

Also if you can make the Night Gobbo unit panic and run than their Fanatics are lost. Goblins panic fairly easily with ld 5. Although if in range of General and BSB this is much harder.

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Mon Sep 06, 2010 10:29 pm
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Bounce, it's not what the Fanatic does to your Harpies, it's what the Fanatic does to the O&G. From my experience, Fanatics on the table disrupt the O&G player more than it ever did me.

Harpies for the win here folks.

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Tue Sep 07, 2010 1:24 am
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would have to agree, harpies. cheap an nobody will miss them.

as suggested the disruption they cause their own troops is great.

i used a unit of skinks once. released about 10 fanatics with the one. opponent had them all through his lines. any that got close to me were shot. then proceded to clean up the left overs with saurus.

Fanatics are great if your opponent is scared of them.


Tue Sep 07, 2010 4:32 am
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Slave on the Altar

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Calisson wrote:
XXLoesche wrote:
Since you can now measure the distances at any given time, you can fly a unit of harpies directly to the point between two units of night goblins where the distance betwen the harpies and both units are exactly 8 inches. So you only sacrifice (it may survive, but...) one unit of harpies to trigger two teams of fanatics. :).
Legal, but I've find that tactics so unsportman that we decided that there is always one unit closest by a zillionth's of ".
Honestly, gobbos are struggling against DE, we don't need to push our advantage that far!


I dont think thats unfair. But if your group think thats unfair, then its cool you guys made a houserule for that. :)

Worst case is both units only have 1 fanatic combined and you trade 55P against 25P (and only got the 25P when the whole NG unit is gone, i believe). Not so nice then... So it may have great potencial in effectiveness but can also run pretty bad. So i think it is okay to use.


Tue Sep 07, 2010 2:43 pm
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Don't forget that if Fanatics hit difficult terrain, they die. Shades can easily draw out all the fanatics on a whole flank on Turn 1, while still hiding safely within woods or a building.

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Wed Sep 08, 2010 12:25 am
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As an Orc and goblin player even fanatics whirling through my own troops don't concern me much. A single one hitting your unit of Black Guard is worth a couple of dead goblins, because face it theres a lot more where they came from :)

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Wed Sep 08, 2010 9:21 pm
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One nice thing about Elven armies in general, compared to many other armies with a respectable shooting presence, is that we often have accurate, consistent shooting spread out over multiple units. We can fire a volley of Dark Riders crossbows or Lifetaker at a Fanatic and feel like we're making efficient use of our shooting phase, while an Empire player may have to volley 20 handguns at a fanatic and feel like an idiot for doing so.

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Wed Sep 08, 2010 11:36 pm
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Executioner

Joined: Tue Mar 09, 2010 10:17 am
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Fanatics is triggerd by 8" precense so shades close to terrain is nice, harpies is best used when flying between or behind goblins or use a pendant master/sorc on peg. Think many competivie OnG armies have alot fewer fanatics now than before.

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Thu Sep 09, 2010 2:10 pm
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Malekith's Personal Guard

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I actually like putting the DR on the flank of where they can optimally move, and THEN bring the harpies in. Its funny, I have been playing more "back toward my area of the board" lately.

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Tue Sep 14, 2010 6:57 pm
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Yeah, fly the harpies behind, that's def worth emphasizing. That way your opponent has the choice of either going for the harpies, but going in the wrong direction from the rest of your army, or going forwards but not having any hope of making it across to your troops before your next turn (where you can play the game 'pin the crossbow bolt in the fanatic').

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Wed Sep 15, 2010 9:13 am
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as a long time OnG player, fanatics are a very big part of army building, if the OnG player plays it right, most of his frontal units won't have them, but have nets and shortbows or shields. Once the frontal units get engaged, they send up the back units and sling shot the fanatics through their own units. Slightly cheesy, but a much better way to protect them from being released from enemy fliers/scouts.

My best strategy would be to scout deploy shades so they could release them on the first turn, deploying behind terrain or something.

Two reasons: first, it gets them out early, 2nd, if he got lucky enough and they traveled 10"+ towards your side, you have some shooting to take them out. (would only suggest for small shade units, as their shooting is usually better suited elsewhere.)


Thu Sep 16, 2010 6:28 am
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Dark Rider

Joined: Thu Apr 29, 2010 1:29 pm
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dont forget harpies can now just fly into a forest as well (taking a dangerous terrain test, but still) and as such trigger fanatics with no risk for themselves, except for that dangerous terrain test.

this way, i think they are a lot better suited for fanatic drawing duty than shades are.

and goblins charging those harpies later on can get in serious trouble as well, since harpies are skirmishers and as such get steadfast in a forest, the goblin loses it


Tue Sep 28, 2010 7:37 pm
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Quote:

and goblins charging those harpies later on can get in serious trouble as well, since harpies are skirmishers and as such get steadfast in a forest, the goblin loses it


...this = slick. Very nice!!


Tue Sep 28, 2010 9:36 pm
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Ehakir wrote:
Indeed, use sacrificial units to draw them out, sit back for a turn, and eventually shoot them down to cause panic tests (the US 5 needed to cause panic is gone :P)


Unfortunately for others but good for O and G players is that version 1.1 of the official update for orc and goblin states that Goblin fanatics do not cause panic when removed as a casualty.


Wed Sep 29, 2010 1:44 am
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Bounce wrote:
The best way to trigger them is if another OnG unit is between your unit and theirs so they have to smash through their own guys first. Another good option is to make use of terrain.


Yep it's what I do too. Makes it feel like you're not being ripped off as much. Lure it into their chariots and important expensive stuff like giants and boars. They wouldn't be that inclined to sling the fanatics through such units just to kill your 55pt harpies. Though my harpies are precious to me and my control of enemy movement before combat begins, so I wouldn't be as inclined to sacrifice harpies like that. But yea, luring is your best bet, 46% or so to get hit by them at 8" range so you could get lucky :)

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Wed Sep 29, 2010 8:52 am
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