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Chaos Dwarves 
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Slave (off the Altar)

Joined: Sun Nov 06, 2011 1:33 am
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Hi Guys

Has anyone come up against chaos dwarves before? I'm having a look at their book and its quite intimidating. I think I may be facing them soon so any thoughts would be welcome.

(My army list is in the lists section if it helps)

Cheers


Mon Feb 27, 2012 11:33 pm
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Generalissimo
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AFAIK there is no official Chaos Dwarf book...what exactly are you referring to?

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Mon Feb 27, 2012 11:45 pm
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Corsair
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Red... wrote:
AFAIK there is no official Chaos Dwarf book...what exactly are you referring to?
I think andy is refering to this book... came out while ago.
Havent read the book yet, let us know if you face them on battlefield :)

http://www.forgeworld.co.uk/Warhammer/W ... CHAOS.html



peace
-az


Tue Feb 28, 2012 1:14 am
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Chaos Dwarfs from the Tamurkhan book are apparently GW tournament legal.

So yep, they've got their list now.

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Tue Feb 28, 2012 2:56 am
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Generalissimo
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Wow, cool, my bad. I'll check it out.

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Tue Feb 28, 2012 9:25 am
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Slave (off the Altar)

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yeah its the tamurkhan book btw.


Tue Feb 28, 2012 12:53 pm
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Malekith's Best Friend

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Would love a good read but haven't found anyone who owns it yet :) From what I heard there are things in there which never should have been written... *cough* destroyer *cough*


Tue Feb 28, 2012 12:57 pm
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Warrior

Joined: Thu Dec 01, 2011 6:37 pm
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Destroyer is very very good, but seen it killed in 1 turn before by withering in, casuing 3 wounds, then watching as it fails it's toughness test and looses the other 3


Tue Feb 28, 2012 1:41 pm
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Malekith's Best Friend
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As a Chaos Dwarf player, I can give you a rundown of the book.

Deamonsmiths - they are worth LOTS of points so kill them if you can. Other than casting magic they have the ability to allow ONE war machine within 3" (including a Hellcannon) ONE reroll per turn. Which means A] their war machines are going to be clumped together and B] they rarely misfire. And they excel at killing lightly armoured, T3 troops. The other thing to worry about is the Ashstorm spell which A] makes a unit flammable and B] prevents any wisard effected from casting any spell which effects anyone but herself. If that gets cast upon your wizard, just have her leave the unit. She might be vulnerable if she does, but at least she can cast.

Troops - it is generally agreed they are over-costed so expect few drops and two blocks of 30ish dwarves as the main force with Great Weapons. These are worth a LOT of points but will be stubborn if a Dark Castellan (non-casting hero) joins them. Chances are they won't break and you'll have to kill them to the last model. Because of the price of troops, you will out-deploy this army.

K'daai Destroyer - to make up for the general over-priced theme of the army, we have the most dangerous monster in the game. And I'm not over-stating things when I say that. The good news is it is Frenzied so will chase your Harpies all over the board if you play it right. The bad news is it is fast and will win the game all on its own. Lore of Shadow to drop its toughness (because it has to take toughness tests every turn starting on turn 2 as it gradually burns itself out) will really hurt it. It has the Blazing Body rule which gives a -1 to wound it with non-magical weapons (and you can't roll a '7' to wound) so it is immune to crossbow bolts until you drop its toughness. Reaper Bolt Throwers and Death magic are your friends against this thing.

Magic Items - only two to worry about. The Chalice of Blood and Darkness steals D3 dice from each pool in the magic phase. Expect your opponent to blow through his stack of dispel dice and then pop the chalice to try and drain whatever dice you have left. Ouch. The other item is the Hammer of Hashut which gives the wielder +2 strength and and model wounded with the Flammable rule (ala Ashstorm) is slain.

Lastly this arny can bring a LOT of flaming attacks but is pretty resistant to it themselves. Hydras are in trouble and I advise you to not bring the Banner of Eternal Flame.

Let us know how it goes!

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Tue Feb 28, 2012 2:09 pm
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Malekith's Personal Guard

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Dalamar wrote:
Chaos Dwarfs from the Tamurkhan book are apparently GW tournament legal.

So yep, they've got their list now.

Indeed they are- the Tamurkan book is GW's attempt at doing for Fantasy what it did for 40K.

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Wed Feb 29, 2012 2:11 am
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Slave (off the Altar)

Joined: Sun Nov 06, 2011 1:33 am
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Thanks guys (esp phierlihy)

Theres some pretty nasty stuff there to worry about.

The plan is thus: Charge the destroyer with the unkillable dreadlord and hope Shadow magic has answers for the rest. Seems familiar...


Wed Feb 29, 2012 10:09 pm
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Statistically the Destroyer will do a paltry 0.44 wounds per round of combat to an 'Unkillable Dreadlord' while suffering an equally pitiful 0.44 wounds back (assuming the Dreadlord has a Great Weapon). Basically they'll pin each other in place for the entire game unless other mitigating factors come into play (Miasma, a failed Fear test, etc). Since they cost about the same however the Destroyer has a much higher damage potential, I'd say it is a good trade off from a Dark Elf perspective.

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Thu Mar 01, 2012 1:24 am
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Slave (off the Altar)

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my Dreadlord runs with the whip of agony so should be wounding on 5s. I Will be trying to get withering off on it as well so the peg can have a pop too. Can it lose its frenzy?


Thu Mar 01, 2012 9:15 am
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It can lose its Frenzy and that's huge because Frenzy for the Destroyer delivers an extra D3 attacks instead of just 1. And with a Great Weapon you'd also be wounding on 5s so it is about even. Basically that fight is going to come down to luck and/or whichever player wants to commit extra resources to the fight. Otherwise it is pretty much a stalemate.

Be aware the Destroyer is Unbreakable so you've got to kill it to get rid of it.

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Thu Mar 01, 2012 1:59 pm
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Whatever happened in your game? Did you win??

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Tue Mar 13, 2012 2:19 am
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I have played once agains CDs. Was not very funny. They had fried my whole army with magic, a magmacannon and a hellcannon. Fried hydrae don´t smell good....
1500 pts. battle.
The battle later that evening against WoC was a win.

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Sun Mar 17, 2013 1:21 pm
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Highborn

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Chaos Dwarves can indeed be a real pain to deal with, but by no means impossible.
The Destroyer for one can be led by the nose by some Dark Riders, and otherwise a defensive lord in a small bunker can also win against it. As far as I know it is indeed unbreakable but also unstable.

The Warmachines are the biggest problem they have...and they have a lot of them. However since he has so many of them a single casting of Pit of Shades can often destroy 2 of them.

And never underestimate the chaos Dwarves with Blunder busses....they have only 12' range...but do D3 shoot at S3; but armour piercing. I have seen a proud horde of beastman charge a line of 20 of these and be reduced to a measely 12 models in just the stand and shoot reaction.

I have had good effect with several smaller units of RXB with a Supreme Sorceress with Shadow Magic.
softening them up, and turning them into pin cushions seems to work fine.

If you want to go more melee oriented taking one or 2 pegasus heroes will do the trick. Expect to loose at least one of them if they field Death Shrieker rockets. (single high Strength hit doing d6 multiple wounds)

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Fri Mar 22, 2013 8:36 am
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Malekith's Best Friend
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From my description I certainly hope I did not paint Chaos Dwarves as a tier one army by any means. They are certainly mid-tier two level and all their points are going to be tied up in war machines or a big block of Dwarves that have M3. We have all the tools we need to crush them.

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Sat Mar 23, 2013 2:26 pm
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Cold One Knight

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CD are in my opinion definitely a top tier army.

The Great Taurus mounted generaly on death magic can get in close and death snipe causing terrible damage.

The K'daai is very powerful especially when backed up bu Taur'uks.

CD can use hobgoblins with bows, fire magic and artillery to remove your chaff.

So don't count on being able to lead the Destroyer around versus a good player.

The burning body rules is devastating to elven infantry.

Everybody in Base to base takes a S4 hit you have to re-rolls to wound with non magic weapons and then you get stomped.

I find a peg pendant BSB with dragon helm is very good for taking out the K'daai.

If you charge with the banner you should win by 2.

The banner is essential as it should kill the K'daai over a number of turns through res.

The Great Taurus is only Ld 6 so death sniping is great he as if the Lord can be made to go on foot he is not nearly as nasty.

If the CD take too much artillery you can just rush forward and sack their gunline.

Their most nasty builds are with 2 Taur'uks a K'daii and Great Taurus.


Mon Mar 25, 2013 12:58 pm
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Wow, I really have to disagree. If you've ever tried to make a Chaos Dwarf army, you'll see that those points just don't go very far. Un until the new Warriors of Chaos book came out, Chaos Dwarves had the most expensive infantry of any other book (now they're in 2nd place). Paying 15 points for a ST6 dwarf with a great weapon is a bad joke. And you have to take them or your characters have no place to go. So no matter what, the "core" of your army is only M3. That is not winning any prizes.

A Great Tuarus mounted General (the only General available who just cannot be kitted out to be fighty) costs 525 points without any equipment. And the Taurus has no save other than enemies reroll successful non-magical wounds. That is so much not a bargain. And Taur-'rauk's would be great if you didn't have to buy a unit of plain Bull Centaurs to go with them. The models look amazing! They're fearsome and angry and big!! And they have a whopping two attacks and no way to boost it. Mathhammer equates them to a unit of 5 vanilla Cold One Knights (and that's a unit I never run either).

K'daii Destroyers are great. Right up until they run into a character with the cheapest magic item in the game (dragonbane gem for 5 points) which completely neuters it. Or the Dragon Helm for 10 points... If you let it get into your lines, it is not the Chaos Dwarf player's fault. But yes, it will wreck you!

Hobgoblins are greenskins. I have never ever feared greenskin shooting.

The Burning Body rule is brutal against T3, low armour units. Do avoid that one!

Chaos Dwarves excel like nobodies business at dropping templates. That's their schtick. Their thing. It's what they do. And all elven units have a weakness for templates. Their lord wizard costs more than a Slann yet cannot generate power dice or have any really groovy abilities. But they do have some cool spells so they're "average" in the magic department. If they field fast units, they leave their strong core behind which they need to break things. But I think they are the most resilient army out there, they just can't dish out the damage in hand-to-hand (aside from the Destroyer which honestly should be pinned down by the cheapest hero someone can find carrying the 5 point item).

I think if you don't know what you're facing, you're in trouble because they are very different from "dwarves". But hardly tier 1.

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Tue Mar 26, 2013 1:52 pm
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Shade

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DONT fight a Kdhai Destroyer

I think hat sums up the army pretty good...


Tue Mar 26, 2013 6:49 pm
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Cold One Knight

Joined: Thu Feb 19, 2009 1:21 pm
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We have been running CD in our ETC Team since last year and they possibly our best army.

(Uncomped they are totally insane due to the Chalice that removes D3 dice from both players at any time during the phase).

Don't be fooled by the expensive infantry you only need one unit.

They are quite devastating when they arrive with S6 T4 4+ AS (he gives them +1M Banner).

Our current build has no artillery.

Taurus
2 x Taur'uk
5 x Renders GW (for 255 points this is not bad and is effectively another Taur'uk)
BSB (makes you stubborn)
GW Infernal Gaurd
Hobgoblins with Bows
Hobgoblins
Wolf riders
K'daai

He rushes forward with plenty of support for the K'Daai so it doesn't get chaffed up.
Then just smashes into you.
It's very difficult to deal with.
The Taur'us never loses combat to infantry due to the burning body.

When he had 3 warmachines I used to smash him by storming the machines.
Now it's way more difficult I lost the last game 13-7.

It's a good army to play conservatively if he wants to.

It's very hard to rush forward and attack it.

I have played against chaos dwarves a lot and I would say underestimate them at your peril.


Wed Mar 27, 2013 10:48 am
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