Lores of Magic

How to beat those cowardly High Elves?

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Darkfyre13
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Lores of Magic

Post by Darkfyre13 »

Hello all,

I have a few specific questions. Most people have their opinion and most are mixed like everything. Magic seems to be where I am not getting out of it what I expect, most often. Maybe I am just expecting more. If you don't mind sharing your opinion on the following lores/spells and WHY you like them and HOW you make them work. Thanks.

Shadow (everyone's favorite) I use to play this but it just didn't produce the results I thought it would UNLESS I got off mindrazor.

Death I see where it can work in the right situation but please share your tactics with it and how you make it work. (not understanding how to get use out of doom and darkness for example)

Fire Fireball is great signature spell, sword of rhuin is very nice, cloak is good if your caster is in the combat unit (squishy)

Metal I actually really like this lore. it SEEMS to have a bunch of great spells. searing doom for heavy armored / -1AS permanent, +1 to hit (shooting / any CC round after first when hatred is gone) -2 to your AS (bubble) and final transmutation is nice against those big blocks.

Dark Magic

I am running a horde of Exec and read the posts where the +2 AS on them is great, and it is but the other spells come in handy as well at times. I have also been trying Shadow and it seems like they both have been working OK but nothing really like WOW look at the Dark Elves dominating the Magic phase. I am also using PoD and a stabby dagger with a lvl 4 and then a lvl 2 as back up of Dark.

Thanks for all your tricks, inputs
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Thanee
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Post by Thanee »

Shadow is ridiculously powerful even without the Mindrazor (in fact, I rarely use it). The big ones are Miasma (lower Movement early on, later lower WS) and the Strength/Toughness debuffs here. Lower a units Toughness then shoot it to bits with tons of RXBs. Pit of Shades, of course, can be devastating on the right units (18 Trolls/Ogres, I look at you).

Shadow magic isn't about single-handedly destroying the opponent. It is a bit more subtle, but in synergy with the rest of the army it can be gamebreakingly powerful.

With Executioners, you do more than enough damage, so you want to use the spells that protect them (i.e. lower opponent's WS / S).

Doom and Darkness is great on units that are otherwise Stubborn (or Steadfast), to lower their chances to make the Break Test (though you need to keep an eye on the opposing General, maybe it is better to Doom and Darkness that one instead). Or if you intend to cause Panic to the unit in the shooting phase. Or if it suffers from Stupidity. It is also nice against WoC Hellcannons.

Shadow and Dark also synergize really well... lower Strength, then Black Horror, or lower Toughness, then Soulstealer.

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Omnichron
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Post by Omnichron »

Feeling that the lore doesn't do much often comes through lists who are not well suited to work with the lore. For instance, if you went for a mixed list with less focus on close combat, shadow lore isn't the best lore anymore.

I have several kinds of lists I use to run, although my favourite has a clear focus on close combat and lots of troops. That's why the shadow lore is number uno for me. Miasma, Enfeeblement, Withering and Mindrazor are the main spells I go for, although I usually take pit as well when I meet low I or warmachines.

Another list I've had a lot of success with, is a shadestar list. That one hasn't much focus on getting close and personal (even though it has characters who kill almost anything getting in their face). It has a lot of movement in it, an agile army, so I put in a level 4 death sorceress with them to snipe characters at closer range.

Some of my lists who has a bigger mix of close combat and ranged, lacks armor penetration, and might get rolled over by knightbuses and some chars. That's where the metal lore comes in for my lists...

Finally, I use dark magic much as well (probably on second place of the lores I use, where shadow is on the top). It's easy to get the spells out, you have 2 spells to hinder shooty armies to take you down, and you can take down warmachines quickly as well. The drawback with the lore is the short range, so it would be best with shadestar, sorceress on pegasus, or with focus familiar. I think I'd like dark magic a lot more if you run a list with knights and hydras, so you can take down chaff as well as those mentioned usages.

Fire... I never use it anymore, although a lvl 1 caddy with fireball is nice.
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Mr. anderson
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Post by Mr. anderson »

To me it seems Shadow is absolutely essential if your army relies on infantry getting into combat. Seeing as combat is now all about big blocks fighting it out for several turns, our elves will get hit no matter what. Ensuring that what hits us does as little damage as possible is paramount in a drawn out combat, as we really are wimps when it comes to taking punishment (8th ed really has made combat something to avoid unless you hit so hard you wipe out most of your opponent in one go). I can't wait to see what they're going to do with the first elf-related book to give back some options in 8th edition.

A level 4 shadow with sacrificial dagger just behind your main line seems to be a good way to go - you can get two spells per turn through hopefully once your opponent's scroll is gone. One spell to reduce toughness, another to reduce WS and your spearmen will become rather powerful.

Like Thanee, I didn't feel mindrazor is all that necessary (though an SSS corsair unit with Mindrazor and extra attack blessing will probably eat through just about anything).
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Darkfyre13
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Post by Darkfyre13 »

Ok a few points / questions:

1. Thanks for the Enfeeble / Black horror & wither / soul stealer combos.... I hadn't thought of those. that would be nasty. What are the chances with a lvl 4 of shadow and a lvl 2 of Dark you can get one of those combos? anyone have the odds?

2. How to equip casters? lvl 4 with dagger, lifetaker and seal of ghrond. she goes in 20-30 spearmen. Never sees combat, kind of a waste of 30 spearmen though don't you think? now the real question, how to equip the lvl 2. 2 spells with a scroll is the way I would like to go to help shut down enemy magic. But are the odds good enough to get what I need with only 2 spells?

3. where to put the to make things work. so the level 4 can go in a spearman bunker with the dagger and throw at the high shadow values with the dagger pretty easily. What about the lvl 2 though. How do I get her close? She will die on a pegasus real quick to ANY shooting and be a big target (oh look free points, thanks) I can out her in the same unit as the lvl 4 and march them closer. She will be ok the first couple turn in the corsairs and then get killed.


My list: (2250)

30 exec +1 move banner bsb ASF banner
30 corsais
30 spearman or 20 and some10 RXB
5 harpies
5 shades (same use as harpies but shooters fro 30 pts more)
CoB
Hydra
10 WE flaming banner
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Red...
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Post by Red... »

That's why you take 55+ warriors with a level 4 equipped with the Pendant of Khaeleth. That way you canthrow the unit into combat, risk free. I take a level 1 with a dispel scroll along with my level 4. Just take a lore where the signature spell is useful (e.g. dark, fire or metal) and don't worry too much about getting 'the right' spell for them.
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