Garden of Bones 2400Pt List Advice

[41spoons]

Hey Druchii.net!

First post here, very new to dark elves, but I've been reading the board for a bit trying to learn all I can.

Here is the list (a Multi Peg list). I really enjoyed reading Syloc's BRs using the multi peg list which sounded both competitive and fun to play so...here goes

Lords 596pts
Dreadlord: dark peg, potion of strength, enchanted shield, lance, talisman of preservation 281pts
Supreme Sorceress Lv4: dark steed, lore of death?(open to advice), dispel scroll, ring of hotek 315pts

Heros 397pts
Master: BSB, armour of destiny, dark peg, lance 209pts
Master: dark peg, Cloak of Twilight, lance 188pts

Core 615pts
10 Corsairs w/ handbows 110pts
10 Corsairs w/ handbows 110pts
9 Dark Riders RxB, shields, musician, standard, (SS goes here) 200pts
5 Dark Riders Shields 85pts
10 Witch Elves 110pts

Special 376pts
4 RBT 280pts
6 Shades hand weapon and bows 96pts

Rare 410pts
5 Warlocks 125pts
5 Warlocks 125pts
Karibdyss 160

Ok, so I'm willing to switch around anything but I'll be specific regarding the most specific concerns. Any advice from expert DE players (everyone compared to me haha) will always be listened to. But more specifically:

1. Would you recommend a different Dreadlord loadout? Keeping the lord selections under 600 was the biggest challenge for me so I'm VERY open to changing something based on advice I get regarding this. Maybe drop the ring of hotek (It seems so awesome though) and give the lord a better weapon (ogre blade)?

2. I dropped a master on dark steed to fit in a 4th RBT and shades. Is that unadvisable? I would put him in the DR unit with SS but that unit doesn't act as a combat block, more of a mobile bunker so that was my reason to drop him.

3. Hydra or Kharibdyss? I've read the threads on the topic, but I'm not sure which would work best in my particular list. My thinking was lacking something to take on 1+ armour units. But I want to use this for tournaments in the future, so maybe the hydra is the more "all comers" unit. I'm not completely opposed to dropping the Hydra/kharib altogether; but they seem pretty fun. Thoughts?

4. My core selections are a bit weird for the multi-peg list. My reasoning on corsairs: great, great models; 20 shot stand and shoot redirectors, armour makes them survivable. Witches reasoning: poison is very useful, a lot of attacks combined with a peg lord/master can win some combats. I understand DRs may be more competitive, but could the corsair/witches be serviceable? Trying to show a little uniqueness in Core since peg lists have a tendency to look simliar, but if my core greatly lessens my chances, I may be forced to adapt.

5. Lore choice for this list? With a mounted SS, death's short range can be overcome so it's likely the best. Metal/shadow/beasts seem nice also.

Sorry for the lengthy post and all the questions. I played beastmen (6th and 7th ed) back in the day, so the versatility of all the DE competitive options is overwhelming comparatively.

There is absolutely no rush on the advice, I'm just looking for direction towards a solid list so I know what to purchase next (looking at you, Warlocks haha).

Thank you in advance for your help, I hope to continue the druchii excellence present on this forum on my home turf! (Mississippi, USA)

[Amboadine]

Hey Druchii.net!

First post here, very new to dark elves, but I've been reading the board for a bit trying to learn all I can.

Hello and welcome to the forum, plenty of great advice here if you carry on reading through the old posts, check out the Hall of fame too

Here is the list (a Multi Peg list). I really enjoyed reading Syloc's BRs using the multi peg list which sounded both competitive and fun to play so...here goes

Lords 596pts
Dreadlord: dark peg, potion of strength, enchanted shield, lance, talisman of preservation 281pts
Supreme Sorceress Lv4: dark steed, lore of death?(open to advice), dispel scroll, ring of hotek 315pts

Heros 397pts
Master: BSB, armour of destiny, dark peg, lance 209pts
Master: dark peg, Cloak of Twilight, lance 188pts

Core 615pts
10 Corsairs w/ handbows 110pts
10 Corsairs w/ handbows 110pts
9 Dark Riders RxB, shields, musician, standard, (SS goes here) 200pts
5 Dark Riders Shields 85pts
10 Witch Elves 110pts

Special 376pts
4 RBT 280pts
6 Shades hand weapon and bows 96pts

Rare 410pts
5 Warlocks 125pts
5 Warlocks 125pts
Karibdyss 160

Ok, so I'm willing to switch around anything but I'll be specific regarding the most specific concerns. Any advice from expert DE players (everyone compared to me haha) will always be listened to.

Okay to the questions

1. Would you recommend a different Dreadlord loadout? Keeping the lord selections under 600 was the biggest challenge for me so I'm VERY open to changing something based on advice I get regarding this. Maybe drop the ring of hotek (It seems so awesome though) and give the lord a better weapon (ogre blade)?

With the new rules, you don't actually need to stay to 600 pts. 50% is now the limit for both Lords and Heroes. This might change how you wish to proceed here, I would suggest getting the decent ward saves on the Dreadlord and break the 600pts.

2. I dropped a master on dark steed to fit in a 4th RBT and shades. Is that unadvisable? I would put him in the DR unit with SS but that unit doesn't act as a combat block, more of a mobile bunker so that was my reason to drop him.

4 RBTs and shades are a good addition to the list. 3 peg riders is probably enough to manage most situations anyway.

3. Hydra or Kharibdyss? I've read the threads on the topic, but I'm not sure which would work best in my particular list. My thinking was lacking something to take on 1+ armour units. But I want to use this for tournaments in the future, so maybe the hydra is the more "all comers" unit. I'm not completely opposed to dropping the Hydra/kharib altogether; but they seem pretty fun. Thoughts?

Your thinking is sound, there are many a discussion on which is better, most of the time it comes down to the armies you are likely to face. If you need tin openers, then the Kharibdyss is not a bad choice.

4. My core selections are a bit weird for the multi-peg list. My reasoning on corsairs: great, great models; 20 shot stand and shoot redirectors, armour makes them survivable. Witches reasoning: poison is very useful, a lot of attacks combined with a peg lord/master can win some combats. I understand DRs may be more competitive, but could the corsair/witches be serviceable? Trying to show a little uniqueness in Core since peg lists have a tendency to look simliar, but if my core greatly lessens my chances, I may be forced to adapt.

Your core choices are not that unusual. Corsairs make great humanelven shields for the Witches and you have enough Fast cav units in the field with the dual Warlocks.

5. Lore choice for this list? With a mounted SS, death's short range can be overcome so it's likely the best. Metal/shadow/beasts seem nice also.

Death is always nice and a good all round choice. Life is also handy for regen monsters.

Sorry for the lengthy post and all the questions. I played beastmen (6th and 7th ed) back in the day, so the versatility of all the DE competitive options is overwhelming comparatively.

There is absolutely no rush on the advice, I'm just looking for direction towards a solid list so I know what to purchase next (looking at you, Warlocks haha).

Thank you in advance for your help, I hope to continue the druchii excellence present on this forum on my home turf! (Mississippi, USA)

Never a problem, but yes Warlocks are a good choice for purchasing, they fit in pretty much every list.

[41spoons]

Thanks for the reply!

So the end times 50% Lord/Heros will be the tournament standard? In that case, I'll shuffle things around so the DL is better protected.

I guess the main question now is how does this particular list deal with armour? I worry that banking on the Kharib to survive in order to deal with armoured threats is risky, and I don't necessarily want to tie my SS to lore of life to keep a 160pt model alive whereas death and shadow might benefit the entire army more. Single bolt RBT shots maybe? Lore of metal can deal with armoured foes. Honestly, magic is probably my best bet. Most lores seem to have a spell that ignores armour.

With characters on peg charging with strength 6, RBT single shots, and a Lv 4 with access to some armour ignoring spells, is the Kharib the most optimal choice? Peg characters, shades, vanguarded DR and Warlocks, and RBT might be able to keep him alive long enough to benefit the army against what I see as its biggest weakness (high armour saves), but the hydra seems to be more suited to a tournament environment where you arent sure what type of opponent you'll draw. A hydra's added bonus of breath weapon, survivability, and ability to wreck hordes is tough to pass up.

It boils down to, does my list not function well enough against specific opponents (chaos, fat heavy cav units) without the very specific, scalpel like nature of the Kharib, or does my list have enough ways to potentially deal with armoured threats while benefitting from a hydra's survivable, crazy amount of attacks, usefulness?

[Amboadine]

Better check the tournament rules first. Some may not be aligned to the new changes.

I would suggest you read the Hydra vs Kbeast thread to answer your other question.

[Silvershadow]

The 50% lords/heroes is now errata'd into the BRB, so it is part of the official rules yes - it is no longer just End Times. As for tournaments, that's up to each individual tournament so check their rules and build accordingly.

Shades are great, I'd go great weapons maybe for more versatility/threat factor but AHW is not bad either. Agree on the decision to take out that Master for this and the 4th RBT.

The corsair/witch elf units look fine, handbows are low range but certainly useful for stand & shoot as you say. I would maybe want to make a larger block of witches to ensure they get across the field but that small a unit is also less likely to attract attention.

Dreadlord kit looks very... one and done. Ogre blade seems like a better choice for sure.
Also, with heavy armor and SDC he only needs a regular shield to hit 1+ armor save while mounted, so no need for the enchanted shield if you go for the full mundane. Not sure if you included HA/SDC(/shield) on all the combat characters or not?

I like the hydra versatility more personally, and you do have a lot of high strength attacks/shooting already. Depends on what role you see for the monster "slot" though I guess.

Death is just good, metal deals with armor but can also be next to useless at times depending on what you are facing, shadow is great against low initiative and good for shooting in particular and only lacks killing power on its own really, beasts depends on usage and planning for it really but it can be very good when used right. I'd go death or shadow of those probably.

Can't go wrong with adding warlocks for sure.

[41spoons]

The 50% lords/heroes is now errata'd into the BRB, so it is part of the official rules yes - it is no longer just End Times. As for tournaments, that's up to each individual tournament so check their rules and build accordingly.

Shades are great, I'd go great weapons maybe for more versatility/threat factor but AHW is not bad either. Agree on the decision to take out that Master for this and the 4th RBT.

The corsair/witch elf units look fine, handbows are low range but certainly useful for stand & shoot as you say. I would maybe want to make a larger block of witches to ensure they get across the field but that small a unit is also less likely to attract attention.

Dreadlord kit looks very... one and done. Ogre blade seems like a better choice for sure.
Also, with heavy armor and SDC he only needs a regular shield to hit 1+ armor save while mounted, so no need for the enchanted shield if you go for the full mundane. Not sure if you included HA/SDC(/shield) on all the combat characters or not?

I like the hydra versatility more personally, and you do have a lot of high strength attacks/shooting already. Depends on what role you see for the monster "slot" though I guess.

Death is just good, metal deals with armor but can also be next to useless at times depending on what you are facing, shadow is great against low initiative and good for shooting in particular and only lacks killing power on its own really, beasts depends on usage and planning for it really but it can be very good when used right. I'd go death or shadow of those probably.

Can't go wrong with adding warlocks for sure.

Thanks for the input! I actually took the Cloak of Twi off the master and put it on the dread lord instead giving the master the 4+ instead. Took the ring of hotek off the SS to free up the points to give the dread lord the ogre blade! So going from MR 3 to 2 on the SS isn't too big of a trade off so I feel pretty good about that.

And yes, the masters have the full mundane kit, I forgot to mention that.

As far as lore goes, I actually think I might go with Life. A weird choice for DE but I'm going to tie it in with my theme. Garden = Life, bone is part of my color scheme and fits in nicely with Life, I'm working on writing up some backstory fluff so I'll post it when I finish it. Also thinking about using dryad bodies with sisters of slaughter heads and WE arms. Could look kind of neat and also cheaper than buying a box of WE haha

Regarding Hydra v. Kharibdyss, I think I'll try K beast first since lore of life should help with survivability. But I'm definitely going to proxy a hydra to see if the versatility as you pointed out seems like the better option.

I like your advice on shades. I tend to side toward AHW myself but wouldn't be opposed to playtesting GWs. Would you reccend dropping the 6th shade to add AHW or GWs?

Also, if I play a higher points game, even 2500, I think I'd work on buffing the WE unit like you recommended. Just can't find the points in the 2400 list for the larger unit. I feel like anything I'd drop from the list would be too big of a loss.


Great advice all around, thanks a bunch! Hope to have a 2400pt list fielded within next month or two. When I do, I'll definitely start a battle log.

[Silvershadow]

Not that weird at all, I just used Life myself the other night... in a unit of Corsairs with a Sacrificial Dagger

Great weapons are a bigger threat to wound and therefore even if you don't rely on them reaching a war machine or whatever (which you shouldn't, particularly with a small unit) they are a psychological threat that your opponent may seek to counter. 5 or 6 is not a major difference, go with whatever suits your idea of their usage best but either way expect them to be an early casualty in some games. The key is making sure their sacrifice serves a purpose