Game length under the 8th

Cappenverra · Post by **Cappenverra** » Mon Oct 25, 2010 4:41 pm

I'm interested to find out if the 8th edition has affected the length of time it takes to play a game of WFB.

At first my group thought that, after we cleared the 8th rules learning curve, games would be generally faster. Changes such as new the deadlier magic lores and the additonal supporting attacks in combat meant higher casualties and therefore less model on the board and quicker paly time. Limited casting dice also meant shorter magic phases.

However, the new terrain rules seem to have the opposite effect. Terrain is much more interactive now and takes additional time to work out the results. Also (for my gaming group anyway) D6+1 terrain pieces is more terrain than we used to play with under 7th edition. Lastly, with the toning down of Fear/Terror and the addition of the steadfast rule and the BSB reroll, units tend to run away (flee) less often.

So far, it has been difficult for my group to keep our games within the same timeframe we used to play under the 7th. At 2K pts, we would have time to play a full 6 turns, drink beer and chat, all in our usual 3 hour game night. So far, under the 8th, we struggle to get 4 or 5 solid turns in.

What has been your findings to date? Are your games longer, shorter or has the 8th had no major impact on the amount of time it takes you to play?

Red... · Post by **Red...** » Mon Oct 25, 2010 4:59 pm

D6+1 terrain pieces is more terrain than we used to play with under 7th edition

I'm personally not a huge fan of the new D6+1 terrain set up. It has far too much impact on the game at the start: gunlines can be made or broken by the roll of a single dice, skirmishing heavy armies given a huge boost or a massive kick in the teeth, etc. We still deploy our terrain in the same vein as 7th ed: take a reasonable amount of terrain, set it up in a fun battle set up and then roll to choose sides. It just works so much better. Perhaps we will change in time, but for now it doesn't seem necessary.

But overall, yes the few games I have played in 8th ed have been a bit slower, primarily because the ability to smash and rout your opponent in a single turn has now mostly gone - definitely a good thing - but it does often mean real fighting is still going on in turns 5 and 6, as opposed to the game being decided in turns 2,3 and 4 as they were in 7th ed.

Post by **Dalamar** » Mon Oct 25, 2010 5:14 pm

Actually, it's D6+4 pieces of terrain so it ranges from 5 (just a little less than standard in 7th) to 10 (quite a bit more than standard in 7th.

As for terrain screwing over specific army builds... it's an incentive to build balanced armies.

Post by **Calisson** » Mon Oct 25, 2010 5:47 pm

Terrain takes more time to set up indeed.
Setting the army as well, according to scenarios, despite having generally less units.

Playing is quicker:
Moving is much faster, so is charging, melees happen earlier, so there's less moving afterwards.
For shooting, no more range guessing (!)... that is quicker too - and there is less shooting anyway.
Reviewing the rules takes some time as long as we don't know all rules by heart (magic, for example).
Bickering about unclear rules takes less time

because the rules are less open for (mis)interpretation.

The boodbath results into late turns very quick, because of lacking units to play with!

Overall, just because of terrain setting, the game is as long as previously.
Solve the terrain and you'll solve the delay.

Hainzy · Post by **Hainzy** » Mon Oct 25, 2010 9:56 pm

Dalamar wrote:Actually, it's D6+4 pieces of terrain so it ranges from 5 (just a little less than standard in 7th) to 10 (quite a bit more than standard in 7th.

As for terrain screwing over specific army builds... it's an incentive to build balanced armies.

Completly agree.

This I think is one of the beauties of 8th end. Combined with the random scenario's I think this has had the right effect in trying to level the playing field a little for those people who bulid thier lists to max out in one phase. I know it has certainly changed the way I now build my lists as I have to make sure I cater for all the scenarios.

Also I love playing with the funky terrain rules and let me tell you that there's nothing worse that having a unit of I 10 ASF saurus mow down ur units after the go through a river of light!

Sad face...

But I think the new terrian rules really add an element of enjoyment that I believe we haven't seen in the game for a long time.

That's my thoughts anyway...

Cheers.
H :twisted:

Cappenverra · Post by **Cappenverra** » Mon Oct 25, 2010 10:45 pm

Don't get me wrong. This post was not meant as a complaint against the new terrain rules. I rather like them myself as I find they add a "randomness" factor to the game. Nothing funnier than taking damage from a tower of pure evil or something of that nature.

(BTW thanks Dalamar for correcting my earlier post. it IS in fact D6+4 and not +1.)

Although the terrain does add a new dynamic to the game, I've found that it tends to slow things down a bit. Working out the results/effect sometimes in BOTH player turns is not negligeable.

As stated earlier though, I don't think terrain is solely to blame. I think the biggest impact is the Steadfast + BSB reroll. These two factors combined have generally tamed all of the breaking & fleeing that I found was pervasive in the 7th edition. Units tend to stick around more in the 8th and this means more units to move and fight with. All taking more time.

I'd be interested to hear if anyone has played 8th ed in a tournament yet and how much time was alloted for a game. Was it enough time to play a full game?

Hainzy · Post by **Hainzy** » Tue Oct 26, 2010 1:22 am

Hey all!

CappenVerra, I never took you for having a whinge. =0)

I haven't played in a tournament yet under 8th but a few of my mates have and they found that there really wasn't a problem running over time. Infact most of the games finished in just under two hours of sooner!

Whilst you do bring up a valid point about the steadfast units with BSB re-roll does slow down the game I think this is offset with the fact that the game is now much more combat focused IMO. With most combats generally underway in turn two (or three at the latest) and with the sheer amount of killing that combat brings, I've found that the game lengths are roughly the same as 7th ed even though you have massive units.

You can't dance around your opponent like you did in 7th. The game is much more agressive now.

That's my thoughts anyway...

Cheers!
H :twisted:

Ichiyo1821 · Post by **Ichiyo1821** » Tue Oct 26, 2010 1:35 am

If you refer to actual hours to play, it remains the same from 7th to 8th edition however what changes is the ability of an army to get back in the game because of 8th edition rules. With terrain, VP calculation and scenarios, 8th edition tends to be "slower" paced being that most game deciding or side tilting fights happen in turns 3-5 as opposed to 7th edition being in 2nd-3rd. Rules such as steadfast, Victory conditions and scenarios make combat longer but new magic system and charge range, pre-measurement makes phase transitions smoother and quicker. Overall 8th edition allows you to concentrate more on tactics, strategy and balanced army building rather than awkward charge distances, fractions of an inch arguments and so far all armies have an almost equal chance of winning with the margin between them to be minimal.