Starting 2000 points of Sisters

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Zzug
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Starting 2000 points of Sisters

Post by Zzug »

I'm starting up 40k again, after a few years MIA, 2 editions have passed for me since then.
Came up with a Sisters of battle list for 2000 points. It's mostly made up of models I want to use, so I don't know how functional it is in the new rules. Tell me what you think:

2000 Sisters of Battle

Saint Celestine

Cannonesse
Blessed weapon
Bionics
Cloak of St. A
Rozarius
Storm Bolter
-Celestian Retinue - 9
Sacred Standard
2x Flamers
-- Supirior
Bionics
Cloak of St. A
Rozarius
Master Crafted Power weapon
Land Raider
Holy Icon
Extra Armour
Laud Hailers
Smoke Launchers

6 Inq. Storm Troopers
Veteran
2 Flamers
- In Immolator -

6 Inq. Storm Troopers
Veteran
2 Flamers
- In Immolator -

10 sisters
2x Flamers
Supirior
Bionics
Cloak of St. A
Rozarius
Master Crafted Power weapon

10 sisters
2x Flamers
Supirior
Bionics
Cloak of St. A
Rozarius
Master Crafted Power weapon

10 Sisters Repentia
Preist

Exorcist Tank
Extra Armour
Hunter Killer missle

Immolator
Extra Armour
Hunter Killer Missle

Immolator
Extra Armour
Hunter Killer missle
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Kefka
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Post by Kefka »

I've been thinking of starting sisters too, and I like this list so far (4 tanks! I love tanks!)
Although I'm not sure if a few things are legal here (I may be wrong)
1. Can the Stormtroopers take the Immolator as a transport? It's not listed in their transport section, I think only the Dominion Squad can

2. Can the Land Raider take vehicle upgrades? it doesn't sat that it can in it's description. EDIT: I just double checked the rules, you can get those upgrades.

3. Doesn't the Repentia Squad need a Mistress to lead them? Although Rightous Zeal would be awesome without here there to hold them back!

4. This isn't a rule, but do you have enough troops to get objectives? 4 squads may not be enough (especial with 2 of them being so fragile, and I assume their sacrificial too.) Although I could be wrong (haven't played 5th Ed. much yet) is it only troop choices that can get objectives, or any infantry? (I guess it was a rules question after all!) And all your squad commanders look exactly the same, gear-wise. Is there not going to be any diversity?
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Elric of grans
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Post by Elric of grans »

1) St Celestine is not a great special character; a Canoness can be better for less points. I have her, mainly to have a laugh once in a while, but I would not recommend planning a list around her. The penalty when she dies is pretty rough too.

2) Your Canoness is very sub-par. Bionics are a waste of points, and with the Cloak of St Aspira she can have a 2+ invulnerable, so a Rosarius (4+) is also a waste of points. It is also illegal to have both a Blessed Weapon and a Storm Bolter (you cannot have two two-handed weapons). The Blessed Weapon is not a bad choice, but swap the Storm Bolter for an Inferno Pistol (so she has some anti-tank). It is also uncommon to take her with a Celestian retinue, as she is generally far more effective solo with a jump pack. I would also strongly recommend considering the Mantle of Ophelia (if played solo) and the Litanies of Faith (which can, and often do, save your butt in a bad situation, though, again, is most optimal if kept as an independent character). The Book of St Lucius is practically essential equipment too.

3) You have spent way too many needless points on the Celestian Superior; her equipment is illegal too. At most, take a plain Power Weapon. Two normal flamers is not a good choice of equipment too; if you want dual-Flamer, make one a Heavy Flamer for only a few more points (it makes a huge difference).

4) You cannot take a Land Raider. Only Inquisitors with a retinue can take them.

5) Only Celestians, Domionins and Retributors can take an Immolator; you cannot get one with Storm Troopers. Storm Troopers with Flamers are horrid wastes of points too; for only a few more points you could have taken more Battle Sisters, who are vastly better. The more Adepta Sororitas units you field, the more of a part Faith can play too. If you are taking Storm Troopers, equip them in a way that you cannot equip Sisters so they can fill a position that the Sisters cannot.

6) The Battle Sister Superiors are illegally equipped. At most, give them the Book of St Lucius. Arguably, that is exactly what you should give them, no matter what. Again, turn one of the flamers into a Heavy Flamer. Squads of 10 on foot will be slaughtered before they get anywhere too. You can expect to lose 8-10 Sisters/unit before you get close enough to attack when foot slogging (this is why I never leave the Rhinos at home now). If you are going foot-slogging, get those squads up to around 16.

7) The Repentia must take a Mistress. They are also a completely useless unit. No matter how much we may want them to work, they have utterly atrocious rules and convert into instant Victory Points for your opponent. A unit of 10 with a Priest is giving your opponent a 250 point handicap. I am not just saying this either: take a close look at them. An expensive unit that must foot-slog, cannot always be controlled, had T3 and a 4+, but swings last. They could be handy against vehicles, but no opponent is stupid enough to give you an easy target like that (and they will never catch it themselves).

8) Always take Exorcists in pairs. They are unreliable vehicles, but insanely powerful. A second one will almost always save you when the first makes bad rolls or is taken out by an opponent. Some people take three.

9) Drop the Immolators; they do not work in the list you have built. If you have an all-Immolator list, the extras will help, but you will almost always be better of with Exorcists.

10) Drop the upgrades on the vehicles. Extra Armour, while still only 5 points for us, is not too bad, but it is not especially good either --- personal preference here. Hunter Killer missile are also not too bad, but I would never spam them on every vehicle either. Maybe one or two, if you think you really need it (Meltaguns are better though).

The list needs more of a focus. Are you foot-slogging, or mechanised? Mixing does not work. You need some heavy-hitters in here too. Seraphim, while weaker in fifth edition, are still one of our best units. You also need to add some Meltaguns to the list. Meltas are the best anti-vehicle in fifth edition, and we can spam them; flamers are the best anti-infantry in fifth edition, and we can spam them. See a pattern? We have the best tools available, so you are best doing some squads with flamers, others with meltas. If you take two Exorcists, they will also help a lot with anti-vehicle, but you will still want two units with meltas at 2000 points.

As for troops, most people are not going troop heavy in fifth. A common strategy is to leave two or three units of troops on an objective, then use more powerful units to contest your opponent's. On the other hand, Sisters have (arguably) the best troops in the game, and Battle Sisters are one of the best units in the codex, so three or four of them at 2000 points is pretty standard, unless you are min-maxing.
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Zzug
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Post by Zzug »

Oh wow, I didn't realize that my list was so terrible/illeagal. I haven't played since third, but that's hardly an excuse for such a bad list. I guess I'll stick with: "I mainly picked the models I liked", Such as the Repentia. They looked good on paper, but I suppose you have a valid point. And while I'm on them, I did give the points for a Misstress, I just forgot to put here down.

Okay then, rethinking my strategy, I think I would like using 3 Exorcists, as well as Seraphim, I really wanted to use them. Should 1 of my heavies be Retributors? That Divine guidance ability seems to be really great for them.
I'll drop the Immolators and Storm troopers completely, and probably have an independent cannonesse.

Would it be wise to spend most of my points on Battle sisters, and have half the units melta, half flamer?

I think I'm going for an all sister list then.
Thank you for all the help. I didn't realize how bad the situation was.
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Elric of grans
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Post by Elric of grans »

Retributors are, points for effectiveness, largely inferior to Exorcists. That said, it is possible to build a strategy around them. I have never used them in a foot-slogging list, but I expect they would be less effective, but if you can come up with some plans then I would encourage you to try. I personally never use Divine Guidance on them, preferring the Battle Sister Squads --- Divine Guidance works better as you score more hits, but Retributors will never score half as many hits as Battle Sisters with Flamers. Divine Guidance, while a MEQ killer, is not an auto-win tool or anything either. Part of the strategy with Sisters is picking when to use it.

Some people mix flamers and meltas in the one squad, but I found it did not work for me. I found pairing the Meltaguns to be far better, so when you need a melta, you have far better odds of scoring a hit, and even better again that the hit will count. Meanwhile, a unit with two flamers will rack up an enormous number of hits, which can (with Divine Guidance) take out an entire Space Marine squad in a single turn. Some people, however, do not like to specialise their squads, and prefer to mix. This way, any squad can potentially work in any situation. Try both and see what works for you.

I probably spend somewhere between 1/3 and 1/2 my points on regular Battle Sisters, but it is not the only way to play. Some people take only the two minimum, then use Dominions and Celestians to min-max things --- a unit of six Celestians/Dominions is cheaper than a unit of 10 Battle Sisters. It depends how you want to take your list. Of cause, Dominions will only work if you are playing Mechanised in the first place; if you are foot-slogging, then take lots of large groups of Battle Sisters. I have heard of hoard Sisters taking the fight to hoard Orks, but my experience with that style has not been so successful.

An Ork player I know frequently quotes `less toys, more boys'. The same works for Sisters. Your 2000 point model count was probably less than my 1500 point model count, so that list would not have lasted long. If you are foot-slogging, you need to have as many expendable Bolters as possible. This way, when you march across to your opponent, you can put down as much dakka as possible in a turn or two so as to cripple them. Mechanised is similar: you need as many vehicles as possible so that the 2-3 you lose before you reach your opponent does not hurt your plans too much.
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