Imperial Guard : list and questions

[Layne]

I am just starting out in 40k, building me a great foolish Guard army like I once suggested I might. Some people say it's like Fantasy's retarded cousin, but it looks to me like that's only in the gameplay itself, building a 40k army list is diabolical, but maybe that's a Guard thing... anyway, I got a noobie question for you all to scoff at.


When you have an attached HW team, likesay swapping two vets for a Vet HW team, do they have to move with the rest of the squad, or can the squad and HW team move independent of each other? I couldn't make it out.

Also, I have an army list that needs critique. Hear goewz -

The Imperial Russian Regiment :

HQ -

The Russian General Staff

Commander in Chief Grigoriy Matvievich Golenishchev, Officer-Starets Aleksiy Aleksievich Platonov , and aides-de-camp.

That is; Company Command, vox, medic, RSB, Astropath, two bodyguards

Thought it might be a good idea to ease Creed in here somehow, though him is expensive. Mighta could an Officer of the Fleet would be handy too.

Father Ignat Illarionevich Rublenko, Priest of the Russian Orthodox Ministorum, with Eviscerator.

Father Dron Svyatoslavich Illyin, Priest of the Russian Orthodox Ministiorum, with Eviscerator

These inspired loonies will each lead a company of the Strazakh footmen.

Elites -

Pestevskiy Pandour Company
8 Stormtroopers, 2 meltas


Grazinchevskiy Pandour Company
8 Stormtroopers, 2 meltas

Troops

Guards -

Cherny-Shevsky Company
Vet. Squad, Sgt. Power Weapon, vox, 2 flamers, heavy flamer, HB or AC weapon team. Vet. Doctrine

Strasskiy Company
Vet. Squad, Sgt. power weapon, vo, 2 g-launchers, heavy flamer, HB or AC team. Vet Doctrine.

Line -

Major Petre Bagratevich Vakhtanidze, Commander of the Infantry, and 1st Line Infantry Company
Platoon Command Squad, Vox, flamer, heavy flamer, PC meltabombs.

2nd Line Infantry
Infantry Squad, vox, flamer.

3rd Line Infantry
Infantry Squad, vox, flamer

Irregular -

1st Strazakh Company
Penal Legion

2nd Strazakh Company
Penal Legion

Fast Attack

Life Guards
10 Rough Riders, Sgt. power weapon and meltabombs.

Strazakh Horse Company, and Grandfather Platon Alpatievich Murometsev
10 Rough Riders, Mogul Kamir

Shturmovik Sofiya Fedorovna
Vendetta, 2HB.

Heavy Support

Matryona Matvevna
Leman Russ Executioner

Evdokia Grigorievna
Leman Russ Battle Tank

1986pts. Trying to work out how to either make up 2000pts, or downsize to 1500. This is not a tournament army, all the soldiers are being converted from Foundry stuff so it's impossible, more or less. Among armies I've seen at the LGC, are -

Eldar with bastardloads of bikes and Harlequins.

Khorne CSM with about eight tanks, and usually Kharn the Fustigator.

Eldar with several gravtanks and Avatar, the remainder mostly Aspects.

Khorne Daemons with a great many letters, a thirster, and often Skulltaker.

Monolith-drunk Necrons.

A smattering of fairly humdrum SM armies.

Sisters with all the nasties - Cannoness, Seraphim, Repentia, Immolator, Exorcist.

I know someone's building Nurgle marines, and there's a bit of Tau about the place, and some tank-heavy guard armies.

[Rangeltoft]

The HW-team must stay with thier squad, move with them ,shot the same target etc etc.

And yes, building a guard list is abit diabolical.

The list it self looks good after a quick glance, altho some speed wouldnt hurt, maybe drop the storm troopers for a chimera or two? or maybe one more vendetta?

Will comment more later, as I dont have time to really look it over right now

/Cheers Rangeltoft

[Rangeltoft]

The Imperial Russian Regiment :

HQ -

The Russian General Staff

Commander in Chief Grigoriy Matvievich Golenishchev, Officer-Starets Aleksiy Aleksievich Platonov , and aides-de-camp.

That is; Company Command, vox, medic, RSB, Astropath, two bodyguards

Thought it might be a good idea to ease Creed in here somehow, though him is expensive. Mighta could an Officer of the Fleet would be handy too.
Is here any weapons? The general concensus is that the medic isnt really worth the points

Father Ignat Illarionevich Rublenko, Priest of the Russian Orthodox Ministorum, with Eviscerator.

Father Dron Svyatoslavich Illyin, Priest of the Russian Orthodox Ministiorum, with Eviscerator

These inspired loonies will each lead a company of the Strazakh footmen.
Nothing wrong here, putting them with the penal legion is a nice idéa

Elites -

Pestevskiy Pandour Company
8 Stormtroopers, 2 meltas


Grazinchevskiy Pandour Company
8 Stormtroopers, 2 meltas
If you are going to use them for melta deepstriking, I would suggest that you drop both down to 5 members each, even if thier new toys are Ap 3, they still cost to much to be of much more use then DS-tank hunters. Lets face it, they are not space marines, even if the cost as much

Troops

Guards -

Cherny-Shevsky Company
Vet. Squad, Sgt. Power Weapon, vox, 2 flamers, heavy flamer, HB or AC weapon team. Vet. Doctrine
What are the weapons team doing here? Flamers/Heavy flamer are meant for assault (which with shotguns, works out rather well)

Strasskiy Company
Vet. Squad, Sgt. power weapon, vo, 2 g-launchers, heavy flamer, HB or AC team. Vet Doctrine.
If you want to use these guys as a fire-base, drop the heavy flamer for another grenade launcher or switch them all the plasmas.

Line -

Major Petre Bagratevich Vakhtanidze, Commander of the Infantry, and 1st Line Infantry Company
Platoon Command Squad, Vox, flamer, heavy flamer, PC meltabombs.
nothing wrong here, need a transport and a fist tho
2nd Line Infantry
Infantry Squad, vox, flamer.

3rd Line Infantry
Infantry Squad, vox, flamer
Would probebly move the heavy weapons here, and switch those flamers for grenade launchers and plasmas.

Irregular -

1st Strazakh Company
Penal Legion

2nd Strazakh Company
Penal Legion

Fast Attack

Life Guards
10 Rough Riders, Sgt. power weapon and meltabombs.

Strazakh Horse Company, and Grandfather Platon Alpatievich Murometsev
10 Rough Riders, Mogul Kamir
Not sure that Mogul is worth his points, sure he makes the unit slightly better, but also gives them rage, which is not all that good, considering that RR are a rather weak unit when it comes to taken punishment

Shturmovik Sofiya Fedorovna
Vendetta, 2HB.
Why the Heavy Bolters? The vendetta is a anti-tank weapon (more or less) and the heavy bolters are not gonna help for that.

Heavy Support

Matryona Matvevna
Leman Russ Executioner

Evdokia Grigorievna
Leman Russ Battle Tank
Not much to say here, both tanks are good

You need more speed, while footslogging guard might work, you dont have the numbers for it. If you work on you weapons loadout, i think you could have a rather good list, if you add some speed and some anti-tank. To get points ,drop down the Stormies and rough riders and trim some other fat(mogul ).

For more (and probebly better tips) visit http://z4.invisionfree.com/Boot_Camp/index.php?


Hope i've been to some help atleast,

/Cheers Rangeltoft

[Layne]

Thanks for looking this over, Rangeltoft.

Company Command : no, no weapons. I thought they'd either be on foot near the platoon and Vets, or they'd Ride with the Valkyrie and get up the other end to help St's and Penal Legions to blow stuff up, generally thinking that the First Rank Fire would help ST's blow power armour, and perhaps help them avoid other kinds of trouble. The madic is surely expensive - I mostly want to help those fragile but useful people stay alive for as long as they're needed.

Priests : I hope it's a nice idea. They should be able to get well up the board and start cutting up tanks fairly early. Also I hope they'll do somewhat to screen Grandfather Platon from doing anything too rash. Probably won;t be that lucky though.

Pandours : I have eight models for them, is the main reason. I thought of downsizing them, just a little less likely to trip up, a little less expensive, but then this way they have a few more wounds, a slightly better chance then of getting to their objective. Also I hope that they'll be able, as said above, to blow up power-armoured goons. Some of the armies I expect to face aren't so tank-heavy, and there's a lot of anti-tank gear in this list.

Vets : take and hold objectives, flame anyone who comes near, that sort of thing. Or go forward and burn stuff. Gave them HW's because they're BS4, so are a better chance of hurting someone with an autocannon or HB. You're correct that if they're going to take and hold, they'd be better off with grenades and plasmas, and no HW's at all. Shotguns are an interesting idea. Hadn't thought of that. It would be a better looking conversion too.

Platoon : an MCV would be nice, yes. What's the fist for? I personally would rather keep them out of combat except with tanks, and he's got meltabombs for that. Switch HW's and use grenades or plasma... that's doable. Not sure I trust a BS3 guard with a plasmagun.

Rough Riders : Yes, I wonder about Mogul too. What I like best about him is that he makes the unit go on being useful after they've spent their hunting lances, whereas once the other unit has done so, they better not touch anything that doesn't have wheels. I thought he might work best if you take Creed, and have him outflank. Otherwise I expect he'll end up wasting his first assault on a single jetbike, or maybe he'll charge a Soulgrinder or something. I fret.

Vendetta : HB's because I can. I could always shut the doors and out stubbers on the tanks. But I figure, if the thing has to move more than 6" for some reason, I can still nut some marines as I fly by. Basically, unless I really needed the points for something else, I figured it did no harm to have them.

Tanks : I expect they're a good combination of tanks too. They can both blow up tanks or troops reasonably well. [perhaps a Vanquisher might be a better option than BT, if I could afford it].


Overall : yes, I worry about Kamir, and I have the models to match it up, then I'll probably switch the HW's to the Line Infantry, and use the Guard Infantry as an assault force. With shotguns. I'll review. I figured if I went for assault Guards, they could keep their current loadouts - except for HW's - because they're still all assault weapons. With BS4 I guess they'd both fire kraks.

Might include Creed, to generally enhance the army, and to put the Strazakh Horse right forward where they ought to be, with Astropath to help them get there sooner. I'll try the medic and see how he goes. It might also prove that vox doesn't help much, too, but we'll see.

I'll meditate on it then.

[Layne]

OK. Here's an alternative.

HQ :

Company Command; vox, standard, Astropath, Officer of the Fleet, Chimera

2 x Ministorum; Eviscerator

Elite :

2 x 7 ST with 2 meltas

Troop :

Platoon :

Command Squad; vox, Chimera. [they stay inside or die]

2 x Infantry; plasma, HB/AC team

Vets; heavy flamer, 2 flamer, Sgt. power weapon, shotguns, Demolitions.

Vets; heavy flamer, 2 g-launchers, Sgt. power weapon, shotguns, Demolitions.

2 x Penal Legion [Ministorums each join one]

Fast Attack :

10 Rough Riders, Sgt. meltabombs

10 Rough Riders

Vendetta, 2HB

Heavy Support :

LR Executioner; heavy stubber

LRBT; heavy stubber.

Weapons for Chimeras?

[Deadlydeception]

Looks like a nice list. For your chimeras, I would recommend the multi laser and heavy bolter combo. Assumming that you won't be moving these units too much, you can use the chimera as a decent firebase.
If you plan on moving them, or if your enemies usually get close to you quickly, I would recommend you use the heavy flamer instead of a heavy bolter. This is the set up I use, as I am almost always in flamer range by turn two.

[Zakath the slaughterer]

I vote for multilaser turret and nothing else - this because with only a front AV12 and so much firepower, they'll go down soon but if you don't give them the heavy bolters, they'll draw less attention to themselves.

You could give them heavy flamers just so that enemies that come too close will get some tan befoer entering CC

Why the meltabomb sergeant on the other Rough Riders? Seems like a lame use of points to me since in assault, the R&F riders can't fo practically anything to a vehicle in CC so sending them in to deliver one meltabomb isn't all that ... effective.

Like your Veterans

[Deadlydeception]

You actually aren't allowed to have a turret and nothing else. The tank comes with multi laser turrent, which can be switched for a heavy flamer or heavy bolter, and a hull heavy bolter which can be switched for a heavy flamer.

[Layne]

Meltabombs on RR sgt. because with a 12" assault they're a pretty good chance of catching up with a tank. I figure first charge through some infantry, then when they've used their lances they can go tank hunting. The other squad, as you see was planned to use Mogul, so that even in subsequent turns they could deal with infantry [but never tanks, of course]. So you had two RR units for different purposes - one using 12" assault and meltabombs to catch tanks, the other using Mogul's bonuses to deal with all the light threats that could kill my infantry, who will be needed for taking objectives. Rage is such a nasty downside, though, that it is difficult to justify - along with the 40pt cost, that is.

As for Chimeras, I thought along the same lines as Deadly Deception - figured that the multilaser/HB would be a better all-round firebase, though there are situations where one would wish he had two heavy flamers. I figured that in most situations the standard weapons would be best.

I envisaged the two Chimeras moving forward with the two infantry squads towards objectives, and then planting themselves there. Vets and Roughs to go further forward and destroy enemy infantry, and any tanks that the ST's, Priests and Vendetta don't get. I figure each of the Russes would be able to assist with all those three processes in one way or another.

[Fatontoast]

starting a sisters army so my preists are a little different but the general thought is priests are fairly worthless guardsmen even veterans will probably get shredded in combat. the general consesus is melta guns are better then trying to melee tanks get close and shot + meltaguns are good against meq armies

[Layne]

Is that so?

[Fatontoast]

however if you rolled well for the penal legion knife fighters i think the preist could turn out well just remember theres no more tic tacing from one unit to another so your going to get shot some i guess you'd just have to try it and see how it works. Like i said above witch hunter priests have additional rules that make you always count as moving and forcing you to charge