Well having finished reading the introductory 3 books to the ToL series, I got back on the Horus Heresy bandwagon (woo!) with Fulgrim. I was considering restarting 40k (played in 3rd edition) before, and now I am fixed on restarting. I played marines and orks before, with my marine army going through three phases as three different chapters; ultramarines, silver skulls & finally salamanders. I really want to restart the sallies now.
I am going to buy AoBR starter set in June and give the Orks to my brother, who is also willing to restart and wanted to play greenskins as he played 'Nids last time and likes the horde approach. I will get back into the rules with the set, but will no doubt want to expand my army almost right away. So, thats where I need some guidance, what am I going to be looking at including in a 2000 points Salamanders force (just so I know roughly what it'll cost).
AoBR gives me a Commander, 10 marines, 5 terminators & Dreadnought.
I already decided I am going to stick to the all plastic theme, and I definately want several tanks in the army. I'm loving the idea of a Land Raider Redeemer or two. Sticking with the Salamander theme I doubt I will include bikes or land speeders, but I will want some Assault Marines.
40k: I'm going for Space Marines, help please
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Kinslayer
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40k: I'm going for Space Marines, help please
Last edited by Kinslayer on Mon Apr 27, 2009 10:19 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Mr. anderson
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Another marines player... then again, I have recently started them buggers too, even though I rarely ever play them, I love converting them and painting them.
What exactly is your question and/or what do you need advice for?
AoBR is a good start, but you do need a lot more. I got some AoBR stuff but it's almost all converted (the flamer/missile launcher combo is one of the most useless ways of equipping a tactical squad, IMO - it never worked for me. I went for the standard lascannon/plasmagun combo). The terminators by themselves won't do much because the unit is too small and they need a heavy weapon (I'm tempted to go for a full squad of 10 with two cyclone launchers. The amount of fireppower that squad has is simply staggering).
Land raider redeemer fits right in (really heavy big flamers... that'd be a salamander's equivalent of an oversized wedding cake) but you'd also want some other tanks to take some focus off the land raider. If you want to go with the theme of salamanders, I would suggest an ironclad dreadnought with two heavy flamers in a drop pod. Wherever he goes, there won't be much left standing.
You might also want to shove as many thunder hammers into the army as you possibly can (I.e. converting your termies to assault terminators with storm shield and thunder hammers) if you use Vulcan, and he definitely is a monster.
HUZZAH!
What exactly is your question and/or what do you need advice for?
AoBR is a good start, but you do need a lot more. I got some AoBR stuff but it's almost all converted (the flamer/missile launcher combo is one of the most useless ways of equipping a tactical squad, IMO - it never worked for me. I went for the standard lascannon/plasmagun combo). The terminators by themselves won't do much because the unit is too small and they need a heavy weapon (I'm tempted to go for a full squad of 10 with two cyclone launchers. The amount of fireppower that squad has is simply staggering).
Land raider redeemer fits right in (really heavy big flamers... that'd be a salamander's equivalent of an oversized wedding cake) but you'd also want some other tanks to take some focus off the land raider. If you want to go with the theme of salamanders, I would suggest an ironclad dreadnought with two heavy flamers in a drop pod. Wherever he goes, there won't be much left standing.
You might also want to shove as many thunder hammers into the army as you possibly can (I.e. converting your termies to assault terminators with storm shield and thunder hammers) if you use Vulcan, and he definitely is a monster.
HUZZAH!
When I think of something witty, I shall put it here.
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Kinslayer
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Vulkan, not Vulcan 
My question was exactly what you did above, what to put into a 2k Salamander army.
How does a flamer & meltagun combo sound on the marines? (Salamander theme)
I can move the missile launcher over into a devastator team
I'm considering a double dreadnought idea, one with a meltagun (as in AoBR) and one as mentioned above for CC.
My question was exactly what you did above, what to put into a 2k Salamander army.
How does a flamer & meltagun combo sound on the marines? (Salamander theme)
I can move the missile launcher over into a devastator team
I'm considering a double dreadnought idea, one with a meltagun (as in AoBR) and one as mentioned above for CC.
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Rangeltoft
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Cant have melta and flamer in the same tac.squad, unless one of the is part of a combi-weapon (or if you are talking about multi-meltas).
One suggestion i have is to take a unit of vanguard (or normal assault marines, if short on points) without jump packs (from what i can tell, salamanders arent that big fan of those either) and stick em in a redeemer. Have had this combo used against me in the past and (atleast with tooled up vanguard) it hits like a train. But also gets abit expensive.
If you want alot of tanks you could always take Razorbacks, one of the coolest transports in the game (imo), but that also means that you will either have to combat squad (if you use full squads that is, currently working on a list that have tac-squads of 6 members and a sergeant with combi-weapon only, but cant tell how usefull it will be) or just use the razorback as a stand in for predators.
A warning tho, using Termis,tanks and dreads will quickly eat your points away.
/Cheers Rangeltoft
One suggestion i have is to take a unit of vanguard (or normal assault marines, if short on points) without jump packs (from what i can tell, salamanders arent that big fan of those either) and stick em in a redeemer. Have had this combo used against me in the past and (atleast with tooled up vanguard) it hits like a train. But also gets abit expensive.
If you want alot of tanks you could always take Razorbacks, one of the coolest transports in the game (imo), but that also means that you will either have to combat squad (if you use full squads that is, currently working on a list that have tac-squads of 6 members and a sergeant with combi-weapon only, but cant tell how usefull it will be) or just use the razorback as a stand in for predators.
A warning tho, using Termis,tanks and dreads will quickly eat your points away.
/Cheers Rangeltoft
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Mr. anderson
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One suggestion i have is to take a unit of vanguard (or normal assault marines, if short on points) without jump packs (from what i can tell, salamanders arent that big fan of those either) and stick em in a redeemer. Have had this combo used against me in the past and (atleast with tooled up vanguard) it hits like a train. But also gets abit expensive.
To make sure your vanguard hits like a train, as you put it, you are going to have to buy power weapons for all of them, otherwise they're just glorified assault marines at much higher cost. And if you take power weapons, you are close to paying for terminators, and they win hands down against vanguard in a land raider and they definitely have coolness on their side. If you're going for Vul(K)an (happy mister lord of change?
), you'd also want thunder hammers wherever you can get them, and assault terminators are the most awesome, toughest and especially cheapest way of getting hold of 'em. Tactical squads of 6 are, if you ask me, useless. They need their heavy weapons and standing power (and 10 marines have much more standing power than 6, which will be wiped out before you know it - at least against certain opponents. With my eldar I can wipe out 10 terminators in one turn without too much hassle if I concentrate fire). Razorbacks are for combat squads (if you have a devastator or sternguard squad combining with your tacticals for a firebase it might not be such a bad idea to combat squad in order to get a fast-moving scoring unit in a tank) and for sternguard/command squads and honour guard. With the heavy weapons options limited to 10 strong units, taking less doesn't seem like a great choice to me.
I can move the missile launcher over into a devastator team
4 missile launchers in a devastator squad are rather good (one ML hardly ever does anything destructive enough to make it worthwhile, but 4 in a squad are another matter entirely, and they're quite good at crowd control too. Albeit I feel obliged to remind you that salamanders would probably have a slight tendency towards the multimeltas in their arsenal... they might not even know something like a missile launcher actually exists
). A warning tho, using Termis,tanks and dreads will quickly eat your points away.
Apart from the chatspeak I agree with this. But my land raider crusader loaded with assault terminators and chaplain cassius hit like a ton of bricks and tear a gaping hole into my opponent's army. I just point them at the biggest cluster of enemies and let them loose (they potentially take down 2+ tanks and a whole horde of infantry down in a single turn. Gotta love these buggers).
HUZZAH!
When I think of something witty, I shall put it here.
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Kinslayer
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Yes, very happy Mr. Anderson, since that was at least the third time I have seen it spelled wrong on this site
I meant to say multi-meltas in the tactical squads yes, alongside flamers, not meltaguns. Running with the theme then, and with no idea of points or wargear options, how does this look... I am basing it just off what the models seem to have, I do not have the 5th edition rulebook or codex yet.
commander
10 termies with thunder hammers
Dreadnought with multi-melta
Dreadnought for combat
6 combat squad with razorback
6 combat squad with razorback
10 tactical marines with sergeant, multi-melta, flamer
10 tactical marines with sergeant, multi-melta, flamer
5 assault marines with sergeant with hammer and shield
5 assault marines with sergeant with hammer and shield
land raider redeemer
land raider redeemer
5 devastator marines with sergeant, 4 missile launchers
I meant to say multi-meltas in the tactical squads yes, alongside flamers, not meltaguns. Running with the theme then, and with no idea of points or wargear options, how does this look... I am basing it just off what the models seem to have, I do not have the 5th edition rulebook or codex yet.
commander
10 termies with thunder hammers
Dreadnought with multi-melta
Dreadnought for combat
6 combat squad with razorback
6 combat squad with razorback
10 tactical marines with sergeant, multi-melta, flamer
10 tactical marines with sergeant, multi-melta, flamer
5 assault marines with sergeant with hammer and shield
5 assault marines with sergeant with hammer and shield
land raider redeemer
land raider redeemer
5 devastator marines with sergeant, 4 missile launchers
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Mr. anderson
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What you've got there is around (maybe a little more than) 2000 points.
I'll go through the selections one by one:
Commander - I would replace him with Vulkan because it adds flavour to the army and fits the theme a lot.
10 termies with T-Hammers - If they teleport on the battlefield they'll miss out on a turn in which they could potentially charge. Why not go for a six to eight strong unit in one of the redeemers (or seven if you want to chuck in a character - perhaps Vulkan? (I'm sure you know that a land raider is an assault vehicle so they can charge the turn they disembark, which is almost the only way of using assault terminators).
The dreads - The close combat one would be the ironclad, I presume. The other one with multi-melta can also get another weapon on top of it (assault cannon would be my favourite).
Combat squads actually are not selected from the codex - they are an option that is reserved for 10 strong units (basically they can be chopped in half and count as two separate units for the game), so six strong combat squads don't exist. Normally the way you combat squad is to go with one unit that takes the assault weapon (flamer in your case) and the sergeant to get a little personal with the opponent, the other one stands back and uses the heavy weapon.
I would also consider dropping one of the other 10strong tactical squads because tactical marines are still much less useful than other selections of the codex. A squad of 10 scouts with a mix of shotguns and combat weapons (and a sergeant with power fist and a plasma pistol) can make a horrid mess of anything when they outflank (I love mine... they are tough, cheap and very effective and I always outflank them either they kill shooting units or they make a mess of tanks - with power fist, plasma pistol and krak grenades they're great at pretty much any job you can throw at them).
The assault marines - to fit with the theme (high grav environment the salamanders live in etc.) you would probably want to leave the jump packs off, in which case you can get transports (rhino, razorback or drop pod) for free, so you can grab two six strong units that are cheap and when they combine, very effective. The sergeant doesn't need a storm shield, though because he won't play "catch-the-bullet-with-your-teeth" to take low-ap shots for other squad members as he is the last guy you wan to lose in the squad, and when he's the last guy standing, a shield is just going to make it hurt more when he dies because you paid more for him.
Devastators are great as they are, perhaps you want to give the sergeant a power fist though (people - like me - tend to assault them with anything that's around, but I'll think twice before assaulting a squad that has a power fist in it).
You might want to drop the second redeemer for anything less than games of 2000 points because it eats away points like little else, and many people will scream cheese when they see two land raiders below 2k.
HUZZAH!
I'll go through the selections one by one:
Commander - I would replace him with Vulkan because it adds flavour to the army and fits the theme a lot.
10 termies with T-Hammers - If they teleport on the battlefield they'll miss out on a turn in which they could potentially charge. Why not go for a six to eight strong unit in one of the redeemers (or seven if you want to chuck in a character - perhaps Vulkan? (I'm sure you know that a land raider is an assault vehicle so they can charge the turn they disembark, which is almost the only way of using assault terminators).
The dreads - The close combat one would be the ironclad, I presume. The other one with multi-melta can also get another weapon on top of it (assault cannon would be my favourite).
Combat squads actually are not selected from the codex - they are an option that is reserved for 10 strong units (basically they can be chopped in half and count as two separate units for the game), so six strong combat squads don't exist. Normally the way you combat squad is to go with one unit that takes the assault weapon (flamer in your case) and the sergeant to get a little personal with the opponent, the other one stands back and uses the heavy weapon.
I would also consider dropping one of the other 10strong tactical squads because tactical marines are still much less useful than other selections of the codex. A squad of 10 scouts with a mix of shotguns and combat weapons (and a sergeant with power fist and a plasma pistol) can make a horrid mess of anything when they outflank (I love mine... they are tough, cheap and very effective and I always outflank them either they kill shooting units or they make a mess of tanks - with power fist, plasma pistol and krak grenades they're great at pretty much any job you can throw at them).
The assault marines - to fit with the theme (high grav environment the salamanders live in etc.) you would probably want to leave the jump packs off, in which case you can get transports (rhino, razorback or drop pod) for free, so you can grab two six strong units that are cheap and when they combine, very effective. The sergeant doesn't need a storm shield, though because he won't play "catch-the-bullet-with-your-teeth" to take low-ap shots for other squad members as he is the last guy you wan to lose in the squad, and when he's the last guy standing, a shield is just going to make it hurt more when he dies because you paid more for him.
Devastators are great as they are, perhaps you want to give the sergeant a power fist though (people - like me - tend to assault them with anything that's around, but I'll think twice before assaulting a squad that has a power fist in it).
You might want to drop the second redeemer for anything less than games of 2000 points because it eats away points like little else, and many people will scream cheese when they see two land raiders below 2k.
HUZZAH!
When I think of something witty, I shall put it here.
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Kinslayer
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Thankyou for your help and advice Mr. Anderson. I think I put it to good use - http://www.druchii.net/viewtopic.php?p=750521#750521